Church & State -Liberty Legend Spike Cohen from Freedom Fest

Spokane Valley could become a sanctuary city. A different Houseman Caleb Collier says that this I'm. Proposing that the city of Spokane Valley issue a proclamation stating that our city is a Second Amendment sanctuary. Welcome to the fire. Today on Church and State, The Man, the Myth, the Legend, Spike Cohen, Hello Christian Patriots, and welcome to Church and State, where we drive morality and religion over tolerance and apathy. And I'm your host, Caleb Callier, once again, your favorite far right shock jock and the show that talks about politics and religion. Jesus Christ is our referee, so it's always nice and clean, real quick point you to the website Church and State dot media. Fill out this form for us. This is so important. It's essential to keeping you in the loop sending you shows because censorship is real and look the algorithms they try to suppress us. So if you bypass that by getting our newsletter, and the newsletter includes a number of links to our show, you can bypass that. It's important. And also, I mean I call you. I personally call every single one of you who fills this out. So if you want a chance to talk to me, which you wouldn't want to talk to me, Chris, Uh yeah, that's loggles the mind. You know, you remind me of sometimes Patrick Warburton. Again, who's that. He's a great actor. He played the tick in the live action Okay, I remember that. Did you ever see The Emperor's New Groove? I don't think I saw the whole show. He's got this this dry wit about him, and he's just like, uh, yeah, weird. That sounds like the tick. Yeah, Arthur, we need a word anyway, I'm getting totally off track. Fill this out. Also check out the most recent episodes. Continue to bring in really great guests, really hard hitting interviews. This one's doing really really well. People are interested in alternative treatments for cancer. To check that one out, share it with friends, family, and neighbors, and of course look it through our featured guests, which our guests today Spike Cohen, He's going to be on this, but until then, check out some of the other ones and click on their name and it brings you right to the interview. Also proves through the amazing affiliates that we have, and I'll talk about one of those during the break. But they're great companies that I personally support. A shop with I use and with all of them, use that promo code, Church and State. Many of them you get a discount, but all of them you'll be helping to support us. Speaking of support, hit the donate button for us Keep us Alive, Prepper Broadcasting Network and OURBTV or News a new one and Faith and Freedom Television newscasters. I mean, there's so many great ones. And then national syndication through AMFM radio obviously with doing what we do and coming at you five days a week, you know, Chris, I hear a lot of people they're like, oh, you do a podcast. You know, how many times are you on? And I'm like five days a week And they're like, whoa, You're doing five of these a week. That's actually unusual. Yeah, yeah, well I can see why. Yeah, because it's a lot of work. It's a ton of work from me and from Chris. So, hey, you want to support us, hit the donate button force. In this I always tell you, no amount is too little. If it's ten bucks, guys, that's awesome and we appreciate it. So please hit the donate button force. Lastly, if you want to get a hold of us Church and State seventeen seventy six at Proton dot me with that, let's go ahead and start the interview. Hey, this is Caleb Callier with Church and State. I'm over at Freedom Fest and I've got with me a man who shouldn't need an introduction, Smike Cohen. I've been following for years. Man is a giant within the libertarian movement. And it's just a pleasure to have you. I'm happy to be here, Kail. Awesome. Yeah, we've already been having some fun talking and you recently about a year and a half ago. I just signed and they dedicate your life to Jesus. Yes, surrendered my life to Jesus in November twentieth and twenty twenty four. I'll try to it's just such a you know, when you're forty four years old, every life story is long. But I grew up in what I was told was a Messianic Jewish tradition, Jews who believe in Jesus, and in retrospect, it was more of a like mildly Jews scented non denominational Christianity, Christianity Evangelical tradition, whatever that is. And it meant that we were non denominational Christians who used Manischevits for a communion and we had our worship service on Friday nights. So anyway, so I grew up in that tradition and when you were a very young child, and I get what Jesus says about having like the faith of a child. I had the faith of a child. My parents told me, and so I believed it. And the older I got, the more skeptical I got. And I think, also it's true, like you know, you get skeptical, and also if God's not real, well then you can do all these things you're told you don't have you shouldn't do. And so I, you know, very early on, I kind of like strayed from the faith. And I I wanted to believe, but it just it was like there was just something there that was just missing. And it's funny because I even I knew I needed to marry a Christian woman. So I went and married a Christian woman, not a Christian. I'm marry a Christian woman in a Christian church, even going to church with her at one point, but it just wasn't it just wasn't settling, and it actually came through that full kind of full circle in twenty eighteen, twenty seventeen, I told my wife Tasha, I said, I don't really believe like and I don't want to lie about it. I think that doesn't make it any better if I'm lying. But I don't believe this. And part of why I didn't is because we were going to this like Word of Faith church. Yeah, and I'm my MS, which i'd recently been diagnosed with, is aggressive. It was aggressive. Now it's been in remission for nearly a decade, but it was aggressive. And I'm going to a church who says if you pray these prayers and if you believe you will be healed, you will be healed. Because here were all these cherry picked verses proving it. And so I'm hearing these verses and I'm praying. I remember, I'm sitting in a car sobbing, reading these things and saying, God, please heal me, Please heal me, and he didn't. I go to the pastor and I say, you know, you said if I if I believe that, he'll heal me. But he's not. Why is that? He's like, I honestly don't know, at least He didn't try to say like, oh, you're a bad Christian or whatever, but he said, I don't have a good answer. I just know the Bible says that he will always hear any it doesn't but anyway, so he said that, and I said, well, but that for that matter, Like when my mother in law died a couple of years ago of cancer. She was a faithful Christian. Why did she die? I don't really am the answer. And then when I got home, I'm like, everyone dies of something, so this isn't true. And unfortunately I went and said, either I'm just not a real believer and God's not gonna save me or heal me, or God's not rereading so anyway, so I told my wife that and her response was what any Christian wife would and should do. She said, I'm gonna pray for you. And so fast forward many years, I realized, you know, this MSS has actually completely changed my life, made me re look at everything and made me take my health seriously. If you like any of the stuff that you see me doing, it's because I got a mess. I would still be in a very financially successful, but unrewarding in every other way career of web design and entrepreneurial entrepreneurship. That was just sapping me in my life, and I'd be like, probably dead because I was like two hundred pounds overweight at this point. And instead I got a mess which forced me to do all these things. And now look at what I'm doing. And at one point I thought, this feels like someone moving me in a direction that I would have never chosen, through a means I never would have chosen. And then that sounds a lot like the God that I've read about in environment. And so that took me on a journey and so long long stories, long story made not quite as long. I in November twentieth of twenty twenty four, I surrendered my life to Jesus at five forty seven am. Fast forward a couple months later, my father passes away. We're going through all of his bibles. He had all these bibles that you would write notes in them, like he like it was a hostage letter. Like he opened these things and it was just you know, like the Pepe Silva memes. He's like like this, he's got all this stuff around him. That's what my dad. It was all these different colors, highlights and notes had them scribbled all through these bibles. Somehow my mom found the one page she needed to find, and she said, when did you give your life to Jesus? It was November twentieth, right, Yeah, November twentieth last year, said that's when your dad did. November twentieth of nineteen seventy four, My dad surrendered his life to Christ. Fifty years later to the day I did. Now the following year, one year anniversary of me giving my life to Christ, I'm talking on the phone with my my friend tub Robot. I was a pastor who kind of helped me through this, talked me through this to do this, and so I called him. I said, hey, around this time a year ago we were having our conversation and told me to shut up, get off the phone with you, and pray prayer to Jesus. And he said, wow, that time, and I'd written it down. I said, yeah, five forty seven is when I did it. And I went, wow, amazing, congratulations. My mom again happened to be there. She goes, did you say five forty seven, Yeah, yeah, that's when you were born. So I don't know, like I mean, you know, is that all coincidence? Very possibly. It's not proof of anything, but yeah, that's my story as. A pretty story, and not just that we discovered that we're both part, yes, of. The same denomination. You know, there's there's a good wing of the Lutherans in a bad way, there's the Lutheran wing of the Lutherans, and then there's the increasingly not really even Christian wing. Yeah, so and me and I don't know, have you ever read the book as American Christianity Failed by Brian Brian. I haven't read it, but I'm a huge fan of Pastor Brian. I watched a lot of his YouTube Theologians content. Yeah, yeah, he's the guy. I read that book and I highly recommend it. Okay, okay, but just when he was talking about this this endless cycle of piety and despair of yeah fail and then coming back to the Lord, and that was that just the eyes, It was like that has been my entire Christian walk, and that's what got me to convert to Lutheranism. And so what for you, you know, specifically what attracted you to that? Well? So you know, again, I the last time I had been going to the Christian churches I had gone to were basically our home church where my father was our pastor rat By, whatever you want to call him, and you know, I would ask him questions. And the thing is, when a very difficult and more than likely autistic kid is just constantly asking his father questions, eventually they just get tired of it. And I'm sure at some point he's just like listen, either believer or go to Hell or something like that. I'm like, oh, I don't believe it. Whatever it was, it was the wrong person to ask my theological questions at the ripe old age of eight, and so I always just had that kind of skepticism. Then for a while I actually went my mom was going to a Methodist church. I was now in my like lateeen early twenty something like that, and I actually enjoyed that quite a bit. And that's more of like a high church experien it's more liturgical and whatever. But it didn't really Again, I wasn't there. I was trying to go and be a you know, uh, you know, live whatever lifestyle I wanted to. If you know, if I wanted to have sex, I was gonna have sex. If I wanted to do drugs, I was gonna do drugs type of thing. Nothing more salacious than probably the average person. But that's the problem, is that that's actually terrible and and average, and so you know, uh, I went, we went. We actually went to a church that I now know was a Onenis church. I didn't even realize we were going to our heretical church at the time. I just do it with Pentecosta and h or Apostolic and uh or that's what they call themselves. And I went with my wife to that that's actually the pastor who married us in the Methodist church or single enough, and uh, I'm sure how that got passed him. But and then that we're a faith church, and all those experiences. The Methodist church wasn't actually a bad one, but all those experiences were like something's off here. And then when I when I gave my life to Jesus, I tried a few different like non denominational churches would at the time, I thought were neutral. And I'm like, okay, well, I don't really know what denomination I am, so I'll just go to something kind of neutral and they're Baptist or or one was a Baptist, one was kind of evangelical, which I guess the type of Baptist really uh believers baptism and uh and uh A memorialism of the Eucharist is your Baptist and uh and the then uh. At one point I was going to a church that was a part of Church of Bob was like Pentecostum. Actually not a bad church, but they all felt like they were a scene. Like people were going there because it's the church that go to it, and the pastor is really cool and the music's great. There's nothing like bad about those things. But it wasn't a theological experience that I was trying to have, because I still even now, I still occasionally have lingering like yeah, hey, but what about this? And you know that's sort of lingering, like sort of like how we're never perfectly sinless, we're also never perfectly faithful. There's always these lingering doubts and questions and they weren't getting answered there. I was being invited to have an internal experience of am I really feeling this to show that that's how I know I'm safe? Well, I am highly mercurial and anxious, and I'm trying to figure out what I believe, and that's not I'm not having the tearful experience that you guys are having, and this is not making me feel any closer to God. I actually feel like maybe I'm offtier because the rest of you are all prying and I'm not. And so I just it wasn't and I wasn't really being fed theologically and I ended up So your your pathway was Brian Wolfmieler Mine was hands fighting Lutheran satire. I started watching his stuff and I'm like, I kind of like this, and I actually reached out to him with some questions and he invited. He encouraged me to go to an LCMS church in my area. And I'm like, man, they you know, they closed communions, outsiders, you know, and I think they're they're they're the ones that'll at least pray with you. The Wells ones won't. But but then I found there was one like a few minutes up the road from me. I driven by it a thousand times, and I'm like, okay, I'll go there. And they were so inviting and they were so welcoming, and at the time I had so much anxiety about so many theological questions about assurance of salvation and all these things. They were so patient and they spent so much time talking with me. And the church is full of a bunch of retired pastors. There's like seven of them, because this is like where I live in Myrtle Beach is a retiree area, and they all moved there. And so I'm like, man, there's just a lot of people here are gonna hook the slight for me. And so I've been going to Rising Price Lutheran ever since. I still have yet to go full through the full Cadic Catechism. Yeah, katechis's process. However, you say that I've been fully catechized yet, so I'm not officially a member, but I've I've had the conversation with him. I'm like, the real presence of the Eucharist is the thing that makes most sense to me, because that's what he said, like Martin Luther putting the you know, putting a writing on a writing with a chalk the Latin for this this is my body or is and then like covering an up and every time Winglin would stop talking, you'd pull it back and go, ah, I like that because and it's like it's it's what it says, So whatever that deeper mysterious, mysterious meaning that it means that we may not understand that's what it says, and we know it doesn't magically, but we know it doesn't transform into like it's not transubstantiation. But then that means it's it still is and how is it it is? And so I had that conversation with my pastors and they went, yeah, that's a faithful enough understanding of real presence, and so I actually do commune with them. Still going through that, I still want to say every time they have new member classes. I travel so much I haven't been able to do it. But I will soon be a member, an actual member in good standing. But I'm already an attendee in good standing. We have that. That's similarity once again as well. My wife and kids are not so much on board. I'm like, I'm Lutheran. Now they're like, wait for it, great news everyone, We're a Lutherans. Yeah, and so you know, I'm also I haven't gone through the whole process yet, but I call myself a Luther and I one hundred percent everything. That they teach. You know, once you were talking about like a Christ and what a beautiful thing that is too when coming. From you, more of that non denomination sense. So this is just simple. Yeah. And here's this wayfer that's like styrofoam. Oh my gosh. Yeah, to go to that to. What the Lutherans believe, it's it's a beautiful mystery. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So you brought up. Word of Faith and I'm want to talk to you about this because I've been seen in Trent and I'm not the only one. I'm sure you've seen this as well. Yeah, younger men in particular. Did I turn this off accidentally? Is it green? I don't know. Oh yeah, it's green on this Sorry I touched it at one point, so I just want to make sure I turn off. So younger men are in droves moving towards more that high church, mama. But you're talking about we're seeing Catholicism, Orthodoxy, a lot of people go and reform. There is even some within the Lutherans as well. Yeah, Presbyterian Word of Faith, Prosperity Gospel, New Apostolic Reformation. I think people are getting tired of these what I would call heresies. Oh and one of the if I have to name one person who isn't even Lutheran, but I'll still name him who has been at the absolute forefront of exposing themself, and he himself is charismatic Mike Wingman, who has just been like, listen, we are to mark and avoid this is not like this whole like don't accuse the Brethren, like no, no, no, don't accuse the Brethren wrongly, but like test the these people are giving prophecy every day and it's wrong, like and it's and it's deceptive and we can prove they were lying. And if we're supposed to test this against scripture and it's not happening. So I think part of why people are turning away from it is like the same reason people are turning away from like some of the more schemy MLMs and stuff like that, Like it's so obviously a scam. And I think that Mike Winger has been a big part of this. He's kind of doing the whole like accountability movement, uh what was called cover up full and like exposing it and it's amazing, it's so good, and I do think it's going to lead a lot of people towards the more high church denominations. The purpose of denominationalism for all of the issues that come with it. The purpose of denominationalism is to make sure that you don't fall into rank heresy accidentally or through deception. And so you have very set ideas on what you believe and on what you don't believe. And if you have disagreements on non essential issues, okay, then we can still be in a Christian fellowship together, but we're not going to be in or we shouldn't be in what is it alter in pulpit fellowship like it's we're not going to commune together because your concept of communion is different than ours. We both believe that we're supposed to do it and that it is for the forgiveness of sins and the remembments of Him. We have different ideas of it, and there's something in the officials that's talking about how we need to have perfect unity in faith and so to be on the safe side. It's not to say you shouldn't be doing it and we shouldn't be doing it. We shouldn't then be uh working together as Christians and loving each other and and and and and and and loving each other and all of that. But let's just be on the safe side. And if you're saying we don't baptize babies, and we say, we do baptize babies. Okay, you're gonna not baptize babies over there, and we're gonna back back babies over there. And I think that that's just it's a healthy It's like what is a good good barriers make good neighbors type of things, and and we end up not fighting each other on We can disagree on it, we can have debates, but I think it's a good thing. At some point people went, we're gonna throw all that away because denominations are what's getting in the way, and it's like, no, what's getting in the way is our own sinful human nature. And now what happens is instead you're now going to the Church of Bob, and Bob has a new word for you from the Holy Spirit every day. And they're all lies. And of course if anyone says that, and then you know they're they're they're accusing the brethren and and getting in the way of the Man of God. That's a cult. And so that's why I think people are turning away from it. And I'm glad because it's not word of faith says you are magic spell caster and God is your genie. And if God's not doing what you're telling him to do, well, then you're not spell casting good enough. And that's putting everything on Etne bad enough. How some of these more low church traditions, even though they say you're saved by faith, nothing works. Let's just like I believe in that, but there's a lot of like, look inward, are you being Christian enoughing, yes, we should examine for fruits, but they I feel like they move too far that way. These people say not only that, but if you're not like getting everything you want when you pray for but then you're definitely not saved and you're not a good enough wizard in the spell casting. And it's just it's disgusting. And it established as a caste system yeah, in Christianity yep, and based on life, yes, and it encourages. People to fake it. The amount of times that I've seen people either fake tongues or fake prophecy because you know, they don't want to be looked at, you know, they don't want to be in this lower cast system. It's really quite tragic, actually, And so I'm so thankful for my own personal dream. I thankful for yours as well. I didn't know you lived in Myrtle Beach. I didn't move there. Actually, really I feel like your long last brother over here for experience is very similar, similar in a lot of ways. But yes, South Carolina is is an absolutely state, just incredible beaches and great people. So I'm going to get out of Washington State where behind enemy lines. That's fair. Yeah. Now, libertarianism and I'm all out myself. You may think I'm a status here, but I am a minarchist. Okay, yeah, and you know, like I joke there, right, yes, yes, yeah, you're you're a micro tyrant. Yeah, I love it. Libertarianism and Lutherans and you know, I mean here you are too libertarian Lutherans. It could be a podcast time, Oh my gosh, but how does that work with your faith? So that's actually something I'm like working through and reconcile. Because Martin Luther was not a well known libertarian. Uh. He was also a product of his time, and he was very much from the end of the medieval era divine right of kings. The concept of democracy would have sounded like anarchy to him. Yet the people were what are you talking about? That's a mob? Uprising right, So I actually wrote this like it was both way too long and also not nearly comprehensive enough. I wrote a post called why we should thank Martin Luther for the Fourth of July even though we'd hate him, and it talked about how so I'm gonna try to do this even to state even more so, Martin Luther had a concept of the two kingdoms, and one kingdom is the kingdom of the kind of the temporal kingdom, and that's the governing authorities, and they protect us from harm and they carry out you know, God's wrath through justice and so forth. And I should say they carry out the sword to do, you know, to basically everything moments thirteen since then you have the kingdom of Heavant, you have the church, and so it's basically the church and the state. In your podcast, it's a church and state. And so he very much believed in, you know, those things should be separate. But he also believed that like you should submit to the governing authorities means anything they tell you to do, you do it. You do not question it, you do not ask differently. And if they tell you to like blaspheme, your response is I know I can't do that, and if you have to punish me, that's fine, but you never resist. Then when the Emperor, the Holy Roman Emperor was basically going to force in Germany and the Germanic States forced him to submit to Rome, he had a quite a conunder, well, we're not going to submit to Rome. Are they going to just kill all of us? Because I don't see where we can do anything other than submit, and Sun he was going to be martyred. He thought he was going to be martyred, and he was like accepting it, and so he actually met with theologians and princes and attorneys who kind of worked with him to develop the He realized something was not an absolute monarch. He is the constitutional head of a of a empire that's also made up of lesser magistrates, and they're all bound to this agreement and he's not keeping it. And so if the greater magistrate isn't I'm trying to still listen much again, if the greater magistrate, because I find this fascinating, If the greater magistrate isn't keeping up his end of the bargain, the lesser magistrate, it's actually at the very least they're permitted to resist to the extent that he's disobeying. It's like the doctrine of the doctrine of the lesser magistrate. And they continued expanding upon it, and the reform tradition took it even further. But that's where it started. Now, that would not have meant like the American Revolution, nothing like that. It would have had to be strictly theological, and it would have had to come from lesser magistrates to basically just back him up, to say don't do that. But over time his doctrine the lesser magistrate got went from well, the lesser magistrate has the permission to do this to actually, they have the duty to do this. And that's a big change because now it's you actually have to do something about this. And there are many other changes, but the real change happens the lesser magistrate were the people who declared the declaration of independence. They were elected officials under the at the time, the parliamentary and colonial system that the crown had set up. These were not like, you know, a wild eyed you know, like like the French Revolution were just the peasants stood up. These were the aristocracy doing answer. But in the Declaration of Independence. They did a very interesting thing. They made the people the greater magistrate. They said, yeah, we're still the lesser magistrate, but our rule comes from the consent of the government. And not only do they have the ability to declare their consents, but they have the ability to withdraw their consent and abolish or alter the government. Now, Martin Luther, I am almost certain would have hated this, And what he probably would have hated the most is that it is the logical conclusion of his doctrine the lesser magistrate. The lesser magistrate is completely in control, and they can choose to just make the people the greater magistrate. And so that's ultimately what ended up happening. So they go back to your actual question. What I am squaring is that I am realizing that using that doctrine, libertarianism is a way of saying that we the people, the greater magistrate, are exercising our authority by the means of saying that individual people should be free to make decisions for themselves, broadly speaking, and that if there's any kind of outside governance trying to curtail us, it's only in any time that we try to regress upon one another, and obviously you got to unpack that way more. And I'm not going to bother getting into all that, but that's kind of where that's settling on. I'm also on a journey on what submission of the governing authorities, So it's like, I feel like we do that a lot with you with the power. We're not threatening anyone, We're just saying, hey, we think we're doing this wrong. We would like you to do it this way, and we've had a wild success rate of doing that. So I know I just ranted for a long time, but that's how I'm reconciling. And I'm still in an active thing because something I told I told God. I said, look, I don't want to be a libertarian who shoe warns Christianity into it. I want to be a Christian who, you know, maybe I have a bias in this way, but if if you are leading me towards something else and that that's the undeniable truth, then that's what I want to do. I don't want this to be about my ego journey and about me going well, so I was all always right. Now now I as a Christian, I know I'm right no, I am a sinful I am Joshua would be with the you know, filthy rags. And if Christ tells me, if if God tells me this is the truth, well then that's what I'm going into as it stands right now, I think, and I think I'm actually reconciling this pretty much. Yeah, I would say that you were you run up your organization and you know, I know we'll probably run. Out of the time. I can probably talk to you further, but I want to can put a little bit more time to get I mean, I want to be conscious of your time, and I want to direct people to your moviment. Sure, because it's a great one. Thank you, So please tell people how they can find it and tell people about. Him as well. So at you were the power. We protect people from abuse by state and local level government officials. State and local we don't really we don't, at least not yet. We don't do federal stuff. But what that looks like protecting Oh and in addition to protecting people against abuse by state local government officials, we also then try to implement changes to that that type of abuse never happens again. That looks like all sorts of things it looks like parents who have been wrongfully accused of abuse and had their children taken from them and face never seeing their kids again, face decades in prison for abuse that never happened. It looks like us stepping in getting those children return, getting those charges drop, and getting them nag beer behind that. We've done that at scale all across the country. Hey, this is Caleb Collier with Church and State. I'm here to tell you about Hunters Blend Coffee. I gotta tell you, I absolutely love this stuff. I'm all about the dark roast Hunters Blend coffee black powder. Doesn't that just sound like deliciousness and rebellion? I gotta tell you, In America, we don't drink tea. No, we drink coffee. It's the food of the gods. And I endorse and support Hunters Blend Coffee. Gotta tell you it tastes like freedom. So I need you to go over to Church and State dot media, scroll to Hunters Blend Coffee and use the promo code Church and. State to help support us. And when you go to Hunters Blend Coffee dot com, not only will you be getting a great cup of coffee, but you also if you use the promo code Church and State, be supporting Church and State and our dogged pursuit of truth. And we're back and thank you for staying with us. You're over at Church and State dot Media at least I hope you are. And we're going to go right back to this incredible interview. But real quick, let's talk about one of our awesome affiliates. And really, anytime I get around libertarians, I genuinely want to go to Mark three seven because this is such a natural fit for any of those who like liberty, who like the Bill of Rights, and the Fourth Amendment has really taken on some great interest within patriots all across this country with the rise of these flock cameras and these data centers, the idea that hey, our government's not necessarily the good guy, and they're spying on us constantly. We'll do something about it. Do something about it. That's really really easy, actually, and perhaps that's one of the things I like best about Mark three seven is it's easy. It's so simple for you to switch from a regular phone to a ghost phone. And this marine did it, Chris and Mike tech savvy like, back me up, Yeah, no, not at all. No, I'm not. I'm like, I'm like pounding on keys over here, like work do something like the magic box isn't working, Chris, fix the magic box. So how I feel it's how I helper it. Kind of I'm probably not that bad, but I'm pretty close to that bad. Okay. So I'm talking to you, the people who you don't know. You just want your phone to work. It works and it doesn't spy on you. I love that, So go check them out. Get a ghost phone for yourself. They're even cheaper than the ones that you're gonna find it the big three markets. That's a nice benefit as well, a phone that doesn't spy on you, that's cheaper and easy to use. What's the negative here? I'm not finding one. So go check out Mark three seven dot com, get a ghost phone, get a ghost laptop, and use that promo Codechurcian state you're going to get a discount and you help support us. And speaking of support, hit the donate button once again. Please we need it. I'm not opposed to begging. I need help. I need financial support to continue doing what we're doing. So please, if you like the show even a little bit, you saw an episode you liked, all right, please hit the donate button for us keep us alive. All Right, with that, let's go ahead and finish this interview with Spike Cohen over at Freedom Fest. I hope you're enjoying it so far. So at you were the power. We protect people from abuse by state and local level government officials. State and local we don't really, we don't, at least not yet. We don't do federal stuff. But what that looks like protecting Oh and in addition to protecting people against abuse by state and local government officials, we also then try to implement changes to ensure that that type of abuse never happens again. That looks like all sorts of things. It looks like parents who have been wrongfully accused of abuse and had their children taken from them and face never seeing their kids again, face decades in prison for abuse that never happened. It looks like us stepping in getting those children return, getting those charges dropped, getting them might beer behind that. We've done that at scale all across the country. That looks like people who are facing losing their homes to Eminent domain keeping their homes. We've done that at scale across the country. We're doing more of that. That looks like people who have been charged with crimes they didn't commit, were brutalized by the police, and the police won't admit to what they did or won't released the body cam foot and it looks like us getting involved, the bodycam footage being released, charges being dropped, and officials resigning in disgrace, and it looks like a many thing. It looks like charities that were threatening being threatened with jail time for feeding people being being left alone because you should be able to feed me like that, if I give you, if I give you a burrito, there shouldn't be anyone stepping in and say, hey, where's your license for that? So so that's the kind of things that we do. We do them all across the country. In the past three years, we've taken on nearly two thousand cases, and as impressive as that number sounds, that's children return home, that's people still living in their homes. That's grand fire not being removed from their grandkid's house because they're trying to populate a state run senior center. That's all sorts of, you know, horrific things that people are facing. Us stepping in and just ending it and restoring people's lives and in that three and I love asking this question. So in over that three years, around two thousand causes, if I said to you, Caleb, and in those two thousand, roughly two thousand cases, we've only lost x percent of the time, what would that number? How high could that number. Be for you to still feel like we are a successful working different I mean for me, and I'm probably going to be in a bit of an outlier, but my perspective on this is if you just say one your success. If we've won one, yeah, we've lost one, Okay, we've lost one. We have had a roughly ninety nine point nine percent success right over the last three years. And I will tell you something. Anyone who knows me those that I am a clown. And it's very clear that for a clown like this to be the head up, not just involved in, but the head of an organization that has been so wildly successful in just a short period of time, I think that God is intentionally using me for his glory because you can look at a clown like me and see what I'm doing, and the effect that it has is similar to like a donkey talking. You look and you go, well, that's clearly supernatural. What's happening there? And so, and I will take it. Praise God that he would choose me, of all people, a broken sinner, that I am to do these incredible things. Not only so, let me tell you how great Jesus is. So. Not only infinitely before he created the universe, not only did he know all well, literally infinitely before he created the universe. He knew every single terrible thing I do think that I haven't even done yet. He knows. And his response to that was not to never make me or to smite me soon after, but to thousands of years before I was even born, dive to a tone for my sin, because that is the only the death of God himself is the only thing that can atone for the sins of all of us. To do that, to forgive me for the stuff that I have yet to do, to set me free not just from the consequence of my symbol, from the condemnation of it, and to set me free to do good works I could never do on my own. In his name and for his glory. I'm gonna cry and to and to witness to his goodness and mercy. What an incredible Dolce cable. And I mean. Honestly, like I'm getting a little bit emotional here, like I love your party in all of this, and you know, returning back to Lutheranism, I think that's one of the things that's so attractive to me because I'm also I'm in the same boat. As you're, like a wicked, wretched me. Yeah right, but that grace, that emphasis on grace and Lutheranism was so refreshing for me to say, you know, it's not about me. I am a wretched person. I don't need to look to myself. That just makes me anxious. Yeah, it's him. If I look to myself, I just get a lot of question marks and exclamation points. I get very concerned and and and can I see the fruit? Can I see that the concept with like that the path? Yeah, I can see that. But I also see all the times that I just am like that, I'm not I didn't put them first. I haven't done my Bible study today. And it's like, you know, and it's because well, I got these other stuff to do. I could have done it. Like it's and it's it's little things, it's big things. It's you know, looked a little bit too long on a nice lady walking about like it's it's it's it's even the smallest things that it's like, how does that go to heaven? How does that go to the perfectly just heaven? Here? I am, I know, I'm forgiven. He has already said, my sins are forgiven. Me go and send no more. And I go, well, I'll try and and and and he still forgives me. And the only way that makes sense is if I'm not looking to myself. Yes, can I zam in my fruits? Can I see that there's a journey happening? And absolutely that's good? But is that the main source of my confidence? I would be in an endless panic attack if I look to myself. That's me personally, I you know, when they're like, well, just think about how the feelings my feelings are all over the place. Double minded is not a terrible way to describe sometimes how I feel, okay, anxious and all sort of stuff. I am not the person who look to for my own anything. What only all that makes sense is that that perfectly just God is also perfectly graceful and perfectly merciful and perfectly loving and that only he could say, and it is. You know, I don't know if we also use the term total depravity or something similar, but it's like, yeah, I am is it that there's nothing good in me? No, Luther said this. We are just and sinner, we are there are Satan center. What was it the snow covered turret, Martin Luther. They're one of the best explanations for us. Martin Luther has some of the greatest I love how like just I have a lot of to say. I'm a big fan. But he uh, he said, I look forward to medium, but he is, uh, he is. It's true, it's It's one of the things I love about Lutheranism is we make it very clear with no and it's not into Noomianism, but it is very much a this is one hundred percent God, zero percent you. The fact that you even want to move towards God is a gift of grace from God. And I love it. It is it is. Uh, It's brought such assurance, such peace. I'm not saying I'm never anxious, but like it definitely is like yes, it's like that's the only thing that makes sense. To And let me add some more clarity and have some confusion as well. Yeah, we're not Calvinists. No, we were while Luther was there before calvisis yes, so so we're not Calvinists. We don't believe in what's described as as double double predestination, yes exactly, Yeah, and so and you know, I mean, that's a whole nother conversation. It's a fun one. What I can sum it up very quickly. This is what I love about Lutheranism. We go God wants all of us to be saved. He is the source of your salvation and even your faith. You can choose to reject him. No, we're not going to try to figure out how to square that. That's what the Bible says, and we aren't nearly intelligent enough, much less infinitely intelligent to square that circle. So no, we're not going to try to create a doctrine of double predestination, and we're not going to try to create this Armenian like well free will thing. I problem with Mueller says it great salvation to us. Salvation to the like Catholics is like a bank account. You know, every time you do something wrong you're taking out, and every time you do penance you're putting back in and if you've got a square away balance, then you either go to heaven or you go to purgatory or whatever. In like evangelical tradition, it's it's like were you taken on the day. You know Jesus wants to take it to prom so does the devil, and you know they're both pretty cute, and you know which one do you want to do? We hope you take Jesus, and we hope you stay steady with Jesus. And it's like, I I am a horrible hurt, Like what you know the things I think, Like if God says, Jesus says, and I love that he did this. You know you heard it said, don't commit adultery and no commit murder. Well, if you're even having these thoughts, if you're even mad or lustful, you've done it many times, well then I'm like one of the worst adulterers in mass murderers ever. So who what am I gonna choose? Lutheranism says, no, your salvation is a trial. Satan is the prosecutor saying, here are all the horrific things that you do, and Jesus is the defender who walks up to God, the Father, the judge and says I paid for this. It's paid and full Teluestine, and God goes that mark. And then you're saying, that's and that's the only thing that makes sense. If He is perfect and we are what we are, that it only makes sense that's hundred percent from him. And no, we're not gonna try to square the circle between being told about stuff that sounds like free will and being told about stuff that sounds like everything's his a decision. We're not gonna try to square it away. You just brought some tears. Man, it was a beautiful breakdown. I'll believe. Yeah, I appreciate you and the audience there vactim once again. You know congressant er time. How do people follow you? And please, I don't think you shared the website. Oh yeah, you're the power dot net. If you need our help, if government is harming you, you're the power dot net slash help. We will look at your case. We can't I can't promise anything other than we will look at it and if there's anything we can do to help, we will. Uh. If you would like to become a part of what we're doing, UH, go to you with the power dot Net slash join you, we become a member, be at the tip of the sphere of the work that we're doing. Uh. Incredible stuff that we do and we don't even have time to unpack up but it's amazing. Uh. If you if you say, I don't got time, but I got money. Uh and uh we need help keeping the lights on. You were the power dot net slash donate and uh if you just want to check out what we're doing broadly, just so, you're thepower dot net and we'd love to have you to be a part of this. Like I said, we are. We are helping people who are having their lives destroyed and restoring them and uh and and putting an end to it, getting legislation path to make sure it never happens again. Literally, we've spent hours talking about what we do. It's just it's incredible. We'd love you to be a part of it. With the power dot and Caleb, thank you so much. It was awesome, are awesome having you on, So thank you so much for joining us. All Right, there you go, ladies and gentlemen, please go to JEP you're the power dot dot. You actually can go to dot com, but it took us along to get the dot com that all of our branding already said dot net. So either one you were the power dot net or dot com. Excellent. Okay, Hey, thanks again, thank you, God blessed guys. All Right, there we go, ladies and gentlemen. What a fantastic interview with Spike Cohen. I love this man not only as a libertarian brother, but also a brother within the LCMS. That's right. We're both part of the well you heard in the interview, both part of the LCMS, the Lutheran the good side of the Lutherans. So I hope you enjoyed it. Share it with friends, family and neighbors, and get involved. Get involved, find a good local church, get involved with politics policies that promote liberty. Church and State is brought to you in part by colonialized Spokane Input and Agents, Finders Insurance and Mark three seven dot Com. I'm Caleb Collier. I was born for a storm. Welcome to the bye. Hey, this is Caleb Callier with Church and State and I want to tell you about a great product, Liberty Cigars. I know for myself there's nothing grander that's sitting around a campfire. Having a great theology discussion with a group of men while smoking a cigar. That's why I love Liberty Cigars. Every cigar has a story to tell. Not only you're going to be smoking the finest cigars on the market, but you're also going to get a history lesson with every single one of them from George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, the heroes of the American Revolution, generals presidents throughout history, and Tonia. I absolutely love Liberty Cigars. I need you to go to Libertycigars dot com. Use that promo code Church and State. You'll get a discount and you'll also be helping to support Church and State with everything that we do. Hey, this is Caleb Callier with the Church and State podcast. Ladies and gentlemen, I want all of you to go to Galileo dot com. You need to stay connected no matter or what comes our way, whether it's government intrusion or a media fallen from the sky, Galileo has you connected. As a marine veteran, I can tell you that communications is essential. Galileo has you connected. Whether it's worldwide coverage, uncensored content, or real time alerts. Galileo is going to make sure that you're connected with your friends, family and neighbors. Just head on over to Church and State dot Media, scroll over to shop and hit Galileo dot com. Make sure to ask them for a free bibystick, and make sure to use that promo code Church and State. This is Caleb Collier with Church and State Dot Media. Ladies and gentlemen, if you're not sleeping on my pillow, do you even patriots? I gotta tell you this is the most wonderful stuff from a man who's given it all for your freedoms. Whether it be the pillow, the sheets, or the slippers. I absolutely adore my pillow. My pillow has the greatest products around. I know when I want to shuffle around in my bathrobe and slippers and yell at the neighbors. Of course, I'm buying from my pillow. I need you to head on over to Church and State dot Media scroll over to shop because every single time that you purchase any of these products using the promo code Church and State, you ensure that we keep our message out on the air. I thank everybody for your support and using a promo code Church and State. You guys, go to you go to my pillow at dot com, forward slash church and state too, and then you get your own known platform right there everybody