Matter of Facts: Advocacy, or Anonymity?

Welcome back to the Matter of Facts podcast on the Prepper Broadcasting Network. We talked prepping, guns, politics every week on iTunes, Ditcher, and Spotify. Go check out our content at mwefpodcast dot com. On Facebook or Instagram. You can support us be a Patreon or by checking out our affiliate partners. I'm your host, Phil Raveley Andrew Nicker on the other side of the mic, and here's your show, and welcome back to Matter of Facts podcast. I'm here, Nick's here. I am freaking zam yep. Today work was worky. It does seem to do that now, and then uh, I put this way. I was so zonked out that when I got home. When I got home, first of my wife wanted to kiss and I literally did like a couple of seconds to WU saw before I could kiss her. That's an aggressively shitty day. And then I went and got my pipe, my pipe, tobacco and everything went on the back porch and I smoked my pipe and have like a good ten minutes before I looked at my phone and realized, oh, today's Thursday. I have to do a podcast this evening. Hey, you caught it before seven, That dude, I'm telling you there are days where, like my little calendar on my phone is the only thing stopping me from just spacing. Out in all kinds of directions. As much as we like to dog on these things that the anxiety rectangles many, they are handy. Dude, I'm gonna I'm gonna tell you that, like the little murder screen in my pocket. On the one hand, I'm convinced that they are the downfall of society, but I also believe that for the person who has as many different tasks and irons in the fire as some people do, it's a godsend. Like that thing beeping in my pocket tells me, hey, dummy, you're. About to forget something. Yeah, so. Rag Ole saying, my children are running me ragged. I feel you. I would be drinking, but I gave it up for Lynd. I forgot it was Lens. I mean, I'm not mad at you, but there are reasons why I'm not Catholic anymore, because I am not convinced that my creator wants me to give up booze or caffeine or tobacco. Because he claimed through his teachings too, that I should love my fellow man, and that's going to require alcohol and tobacco and coffee. It's just fair, you know. I do think there is some good to doing periodic periodic intentional withdrawal from certain things. I disagree wholeheartedly. I don't know, man. I regularly will run out of bourbon and then just forget to get more. Like sometimes it'll go like six months, or I'll be like, oh, you know, I'd like to have a bourbon, go over to the kitchen, like we are entirely out of booze. All right, But point of order, I don't believe you're an alcoholic. No, definitely not. I am a coffee holic. True, I happily admit I have a chemical dependency to caffeine. It is clinical. It might be terminal, but it is a thing. It will be terminal for somebody. It will be terminal for somebody. I'm not saying I would commit like acts of physical violence if I wasn't allowed to have coffee, but I am saying that the chance is more than zero. I I kind of get my theory on on that from. I think it was either Marcus Aurelius or Socrates. It was one of the Stoic philosophers. All things in moderation, especially moderation, and then being in the theory of being intentional with the things that you do. Like, yeah, I make coffee every morning. I do, but there are some days where I very intentionally have a coffee, and I will just have a coffee because yeah, I do enjoy it. But I don't want to ever get to the point of any substance or any like dependency and any dependency where I'm not the one choosing to do this, if that makes sense. So, I mean it is worth pointing out that, like, there have been periods where I have involuntarily not had the ability to drink coffee. Sure, and I wasn't really happy about it, but it wasn't like I was like, you know, walking up and down the street, like you know, doing this, yeah, yeah, you know, picking my scabs and stuff. It was just a I really don't like my fellow man, and I would tolerate them a little bit better if I were caffeinated. That's fair. That's fair. But anyway, admin work and then the topic that will not require spreadsheets, it will not require banners. This is going to be like just two friends talking about a thing that I imagine at least most of the audience will probably resonate with The audience is composed of patrons tonight, which I'm thankful for. They promote my own personal and Nick's poor behavior and poor decisions. And we appreciate y'all supporting us in the show and each other because you know, one of the cool things about being a patron is that I let you behind the curtain to have a peek at the wizard eyes, and you also get entry into a private chat with all the rest of the. Patrons, And when they're not busting church balls. They're actually pretty helpful to each other, like wildly helpful. It's like YouTube, university and text form. Yes, it doesn't really hurt that. Like literally, I can't think of a single person in that chat that does not have some some area of expertise that their knowledge just blows everybody else away. Yeah, not a single one everybody. And there is some overlap where you've got multiple people with very in depth experience on the same subject. But the amount the breadth of topics that can be covered in that chat is astonishing. Yes, And if you do like I do sometimes and you unplug because you're busy, you come back to like one hundred and forty miss messages, and I just scroll all the way the bomb and be like, if it was important, y'all will fill me in later. Yep, I was not tagged in any of this good. Excellent code mof a disaster coffee. I was drinking disaster coffee most of the day and then I had to switch to a coffee crack to get me through the rest of my evening, caffeinated coffee, caffeinated energy drinks. Whoever had the bright idea to put monster and coffee together was a sociopath or a brilliant person. I'm not I'm not sure which both, probably both. But we don't sell We don't sell java monsters in the store, unfortunately, but a disaster coffee. We do sell all manner of coffee, everything from green beans to roasted coffee, the. Whole bean, to. Coffee pots that are compatible with your desktop fast coffee brewer that starts with a K. But you can't use the word because it's trademarked, which is why I'm putting in air quotes for the audio listeners and merchan of the Southern Gals. I don't know one hundred percent, but I think I saw saw the principle of Southern Gals mentioned something about a kill Dozer shirt. Oh yes, I did see the potential for a Killdozer shirt. Yeah. So I'm just gonna say that if Burt if your personal little then diagram is like The Road Warrior, Burt Gummer, Kill Dozer and The Walking Dead, you should probably look into the Southern Gals. The links in the show description fun shirts, fun stuff, and it supports small business and does now. Phil, this reminds me. Ragal reminds us again. We need to find a way for him to give you money to get him into the chat that is not Patron because he doesn't like it on principle, which I understand. Patreon is kind of anti everything we like. Yes, but it's a very simple platform that works. That's kind of my problem, and only fans has connotations. And he's not the only person that's asked. I really need to put a block on my weekend calendar and try to figure that out. I mean, there are other options, I. Just I am sure there are. I don't well, I mean I can think of a fairly simple one. I'm just trying to think if there's a more replicatable than that single simple solution, rebel. I don't think you can just straight up send Phil venmos of cash that will flag the irs. He is a government employee. I am already on enough watch lists, thank you. Also, my employer credit checks me annually. Actually, no, not annually. I think it's every five years. I have to have a security claimance read on every five years. That's how you know you have a big boy job. Oh, does that mean that you have to list me as a known associate? They haven't asked for my known associates, So I'm not. Going to volunteer the information. I wouldn't, I assure as hell am not, because I'm pretty sure that the fact that I'm already on this many government watch list is concerning enough. When they realize that all my friends are also all of those say watch list, that's when the questions are really going to start. We're trying to get our names as close together on as many lists as possible. That is the goal. I'm pretty sure that's how I'm pretty sure that's how cults and commune start. But well, let's not go there. True, but they're fun, yeah, until the ATF burns it to the ground. Well yeah, but I mean so is owning sharp bailed shotguns until the ATF burns your house to the ground. There's a lot of fun stuff that causes the ATF to burn your house down. You see the theme developing, though I do everything that's fun gets your house burned down. Turns out our is the solution the government uses apparently. Anyway, the topic is advocacy or anonymity, and we we on the show. I think it might have been me and Andrew have definitely talked about this in one point in the past, but like, this is a talk that keeps coming up because personally, because. Like I I have. When I decided to start this podcast, especially under my full Christian name, I pretty much yieaded anonymity into the wind, like immediately. But even then, like you know, we know people in the community who have like done content creation under assumed identities, and it was found out later what their real names were. Like, it's really hard to hide. And until someone decides to not let you be anonymous. Yeah, And the problem is is, like I see two side effects of trying to maintain your anonymity and doing something like this, And one is that there is a certain segment of the population that immediately becomes distrusting because you tried to hide your identity, and it's kind of hard to argue against that. But the other problem is is, like my observation has always been that people tend to dig when it seems like there's something to dig. Like if you try to hide, people notice, they notice what's not visible, and they go looking for it, as opposed to if you just go out on the internet and start talking about stuff like totally above board out in the open, people tend to not look very hard because you're already out in the open, like there's no secrets. Here, or they assume you're just a full on fed plant, which you can't win them all. I mean, there is a running joke in the patron chat about the fact that like several of our friend group literally work for the government. Yeah, I mean, and quite a many million people do well. And I was also going to say, like, given the number of global war and Tara bets that are out there, even the guys in private sector nowadays used to work for the government and still have back you know, still have active background checks hex running. Yeah. Anyway, but like I said, that's that's kind of the. That's the topic. That's what I wanted to talk about tonight because I bore witness to this within the last few days, because my daughter, God bless her, decided to tee off on a group of friends of hers who were having a very spirited political debate, and she took the opposite opinion they all did, and she pretty well took them all to task over what she viewed as inconsistencies in the fact the things they were presenting as fact. And I did, briefly, I don't know why I did, briefly try to co're like, hey, maybe not choose violence, like you know. You try to sign a good dad thing. Well, you know the thing I've always tried to coach her on, and like it's moderately frustrating sometimes because there are times when I look at her and I think to myself, oh my god, you're your mother's child. But then there's moments like the other night, where I look at her, I'm like, oh, no, that is Phil Junior right there. Because when I was her age, I never saw an argument I wanted to walk away from. I chose violence as a default position. If I thought I was right, I was ready to go to war. Yeah, over anything because I thought I was right and I wasn't going to back down. There was no there was no thought given to diplomacy or to let the other just walk away. It's not worth fighting about her, it's not worth arguing about It's like, no, I'm right there wrong, I want to argue, Well, yeah, you can see that. Folks like yourself and me, a lot of times we look at things in a very fact based perspective. Black and white, very black and white, very literal words have meanings, definitions do matter, and if you're using them wrong, your entire argument is meaningless. So it's not so much are we having a discussion or an argument is no, you're wrong. There is no gray area, there is no discussion. You are factually incorrect. You cannot say that the sun revolves around the earth. That's not how it works. You're an idiot. But it doesn't always make friends. Yeah, And that's that's the thing. I was trying to coach her on the other day, because like, these are good friends of hers, and I was trying to encourage her to not grenade her friendships. But it got me thinking down down this road of like, you know, the decision point a lot of US. Various communities have had to make over the years about do I advocate or do I just like let it slide so I can stay under the radar a little bit. And I feel like any like anybody that's in the preparedness community, the Second Amendment community, anybody that's really like I don't even want to say political, like they run for offices, but just like politically switched on. There's a lot of people in a lot of different communities, man, that like, whether they've thought about or not, they have to make this. They have to make this decision point at some point of sure, do I fight it out? Do I stand on do I stand on business and stand for my beliefs. I heard something in passing. It could have been friend group, family, dinner table, co workers, at work, church. It could be anywhere. But I heard something that just wasn't right. It was factually incorrect, It was false, it was a it was a it didn't jive what I know the facts of that, that situation to be, do I let it slide or do I be the person the naysayer in the group? And what kind of ill will does that. Buy me after the fact? You know, Yeah, I know I know what you do. I know what you mean, and I think that there's also almost a third option that you depending on the group of people that you're with. I have found myself among my friends as one of the more conservative ones. Hey, you know what fair enough. When the whole Roe v. Wade thing was going on with Scotis and that got overturned, there was a discussion that occurred in my basement, just on the other side of this wall next to me here, where people were very, very against the ruling that had occurred, and they did not understand the ruling at all. It wasn't ruling for or against abortion. It was ruling whether or not that medical topic was covered under the section of the Constitution that was cited in the original ruling. And when I said, look, that is actually what is being ruled on here, it was ruled correctly because it's not written in the Constitution that that is what is there. It is not a pro It is not an anti abortion discussion at all. It is a are these words in this document? Yes or no? The answer is no. They took that as I am anti abortion. Now I am, but that's not the point. You know. It's sometimes you get you can get into these discussions accidentally, even by just pointing out, yeah, but this is the actual thing that is being discussed in the law instead of yes, I'm for, yes I'm against whatever situation. You know, this reminds me. I had this experience with Gillian of all people, several weeks ago, and like, just to level set expectations, I am very much anti abortion, yeah, and I am nine hun percent sure Gillian feels the same way. But when when the ruling came down, you were referring to Louisiana, I can't remember if immediately passed legislation or had trigger had a trigger legislation. Basically on standby rero view, it was ever overturned. Believe it was trigger legislation or legislation that was already on the books that would have been re enacted. Were that, and that's what I referred to as trigger legislation. In other words, it was it was a law that was overruled by by federal statute, with the understanding that if federal statute ever gets overturned, this jumps into play immediately, and it has created a situation in Louisiana where abortion is basically not just not possible sure. Now, Gillian brought to my attention that there was a there was a case recently where a young woman literally nearly died because like her, she hadn't miscarried, and the the the unborn now deceased child need to be d n C to remove from her body. But what was claimed in the article was because of the new the new laws in Louisiana, that procedure could not be performed and this woman became septic and nearly died as a result of it. It was the it was the very classic stereotypic stupid conservatives passed this law and it hurt woman's women's health. And Gillian was very, very upset and alarm by this, like you know, whether this was an unintended consequence or not, like this is a really bad thing. And I agreed with her, but I went and read. But I went and read the law, and literally what the law states is that you cannot have you cannot perform a procedure that terminates the life of the child once once medically legally it's determined that that that unborn child is no longer alive. There's nothing stopping that doctor, any from doctor from removing the dead head child m HM. So I pointed this out to her, and I'm like, I need more information because. Was that the one where the doctors and nurses purposefully delayed her care to try and make a news story out of it? Kind of seems like. It, because I couldn't remember. I remember there being something like that that happened in a couple different places where it seemed like it was activist doctors and nurses purposefully not understanding the law. Yeah, kind of like taking the law to the point of absurdity that way they that way they could make an issue out of it. And like I told, like I told my wife that was kind of that was kind of what I thought was going on once I really read the law, and I mean I literally googled the specific statue and read it word for word, and I'm like, there's nothing in here that precludes that. So if you want to argue that, like the doctors missunderstood the law and that is an unintended consequence of passing a law like this is that some doctors don't understand it, Like, okay, fair point, but the law did not cause this issue. No, that's the doctor's fault for not being properly educated. But to our point about advocacy versus antonymity, in that moment, with the emotions in the room, there was every possibility that I bring those facts forward and immediately have called an altercation with my wife because she's emotional and she's upset, and I am kind of like being a naysayer in the room. It's another one of those examples about how, especially when you're dealing with an emotionally charged issue, there can be that price to be paid for being the person that is logical and just says, well that I raise a statute. It doesn't say. That that at the very least is the educated person in the room on the topic. You know, in this case, I read it. I read her the law, and then she got twice as pissed off as the doctors as she was. Story that was one hundred percent on the doctors. That is not at all on anyone else other than the doctors. Who I mean, look, look, you're a gun owner. I'm a gun owner. It is on us to understand firearms law better than the police, yes, better than the ATF, and god forbid, hopefully at least good enough that you're not accidentally committing felonies. Now, ignorance of the law has never been a defense. Exactly, law is not a defense. Those doctors should be at least as knowledgeable about medical related law as I am about firearms law, because people's lives are in their hands when it comes to this. In Italy, I have a better education than the average person. But yeah, I read the statute, so do doctors. My thirteen year old could have read that and figured out what it meant. But I have a hard time giving ground on the idea that like it was a lack of understanding, just in this one individual case. I just I unless, unless, unless these doctors get their their understanding of law off of TikTok and social media, because like I said, I went read the statute. I do believe that a lot of them do, though I do believe a lot of people looking terrifying well, but in their defense, being a doctor requires a very wide knowledge base. I think it does. Long hours, long shifts, very high stress job. But I think at this in this case, there's no excuse for it at a very least the hospital not having had a policy meeting and said this is the hospital's policy, this is what the law says they have hundreds of lawyers. I'm sure that's and that's my problem. You cannot convince me that the hospital system doesn't have lawyers on freaking staff specifically for moments like this. I guarantee you those hot. The second that case got brought before the Supreme Court, the hospital lawyers went all right, here's what we're gonna have to do if X happens. Here's what we're gonna have to do if why happens. They're gonna have binders full of stuff for that. Because I've worked in the manufacturing sector for a long time, and we've had meetings with lawyers about various foreign policy things that have occurred regarding even just tariffs. Okay, you can't tell me lately that a multi hundred million dollar hospital system doesn't have better lawyers than a two million dollar a year manufacturing business. One would hope, one would hope. I mean, yeah, But. I mean I get I guess back more towards the center line, like how do you figure out how to wear the draw that line? Because like that was that was the thing that you and I were talking about the other day when I kind of brought this up, was like you know I am fortunately foolish enough, I guess to consider that because I would not engage in speech that would rise to the level of being legally actionable. Let's phrase it just like that. Sure, I might say controversial things, spicy things, even overtly upsetting things. Sure, but I also kind of feel like if I'm if as long as I'm not going to the point of legal action, then I should be able to say whatever I want and keep my private keep my private life separate from my work life. I don't do. I don't talk about this kind of stuff very openly in my workplace. I have a few people that they know me, they know what I'm about. We'll talk about things kind of quietly. But it's not like I stand on the stump and you know, beat my chest about any sort of political or you know, farms related issue at work because it's inappropriate, right. But I've also been in that situation where, like I've heard things set out loud that were factually incorrect, and whether it was foolish or not, I just couldn't help myself but to like speak up and be like, that's not that's not accurate, that's not right. Yeah, but even I don't know where to tell somebody to draw the line because I'm still figuring that out situation by situation. I think that for a very long time, Conservatives drew the line way too far back. They held way too much back for way too long. And that is why one of the reasons we're in the position we're in right now. Why do you think that is because I have a theory. Because the polite thing to do in like say, like dinner table discussion was always no religion, no politics, no money. Well, the impolite people were willing to talk about religion, politics, and money, and the people that tend to be more fringe are often less polite with their views. The right pushed down they're extremists for a very long time and continue to do so. The left went extremists are useful because extremism for the left worked historically in like the Soviet Union in China and the various other socialist revolutions. That's why I think that's why. And the conservatives said, no, we're going to be the polite professionals. And guess what, the people that shout the loudest tend to get heard. Unfortunately, so we need to start shouting louder. I think and see. I think my perspective was simpler, not necessarily correct, but simpler than that. Sure, I think your average conservative is far too concerned about being likable. Yes, I think your averagislation is far too concerned about being likable, not even just conservatives, because you saw that at the State of the Union address, if you watched any of that, every one of the Democrats was looking around to see what each other were doing, to make sure they were still in the club. But I don't know if I agree that it's everyone, because the most I ever spoke, if the most outspoken, vociferous liberals I personally know in my personal life to give less than zero fox if they offend or upset any conservative and attendance. They feel morally justified in upsetting the other side because their opinions are right, and if you're upset, that's a you problem. I only see this behavior of like I still want to be invited to the table, into the club. I only see it from one side. The other side doesn't seem to give a shit and doesn't really want the other side in their club. But that's an outgrowth of what I was referring to phil that's an outgrowth of the college intelligentsia, who they got their way by shouting down their opponents at these gatherings, that struggle sessions. Yeah, struggle sessions. The loudest person in the room got their way, and that tended to be the most extreme person, and that's why they all started feeding into that with each other. And then the outright demonization of anyone that did not agree with them and did not struggle hard enough at the struggle sessions was clearly the enemy, and the enemy only exists to be destroyed. So given that that is the backdrop we're talking about, and like, you and I are in interesting situations because like you live in an extraordinarily liberal state and I work in an extraordinarily liberal workplace, and we're both in situations where, like I feel like it's a fair assumption that the majority of the time our opinion kind of cuts against the grain of everyone around us. Yes, I would say that's fair, at least at least the majority population in the in the urbanized and semi urbanized centers around me. Yes. Yeah, So what do we do? Just not give a shit if relikable. Or not that has always been my solution. I pretty much go by the rule of I would rather be hated for who I am than hate who I am pretending to be. I mean, that's fair. I find that. I'm okay not being invited to the dinner party or to the country club. I want to be in places where I feel welcomed and wanted, and lying to get there, I'm neither welcomed nor wanted. In truth, no, that's fair. I find that. Really within the last five or six years, since my career has kind of taken a different track at work, Like I wouldn't say it's I wouldn't say office politics guide everything, but I have reached a point where there is a certain amount office politics involved. Like once you get up to a certain point any organization, there's there's going to be a necessity as a component of your job that you be able to work with other people, and sometimes being able to work with their people means them not despising the very side of you. Sure, and I find that that that is the situation I find myself in very often, Like I know, I'm already fighting from the bottom up. You and I've talked about the fact. That like there there there are literally there have literally been you know, I don't know to what degree, but human resources has looked into this podcast to see what exactly I talk about on it. Sure, that's that's. The level of scrutiny I have invited into my life, into my you know, into my professional life, simply by having a podcast. Simply by existing outside the orthodoxy of your of your office. Yeah, you know, you know. On the one hand, I invited that because I kind of started this podcast all these years ago under my full name, pretty much always said, you know, let come what may. I don't care. But I have to admit it was kind of a sober experience when I found out, like, oh, yes, people are actively crawling through your social media to try to find out, like, have you said anything that they can get you in trouble for? Yeah, why would they not. You're an enemy of the revolution, phil That's what they see you as. Call me idealistic. I thought I was just a coworker who was super helpful, knowledgeable. But see that is because you're not an idealogue. You're not You've not been captured by an idea to the point where you can't separate it from what's going on around you. I can't even imagine what that would be like. A I can't either, And maybe that's just how our personalities are wired. Perhaps. I mean, I give a piece of advice whenever we get like an intern or an apprentice that I start working with and they come up to me with a problem, because there's always personal disagreements in any workplace. And hey, in blue collar sometimes somebody's gonna call you a dumb fuck for doing some dumb fuck shit. That's that's gonna happen. God and blue collar environments. Some some kids they just they just they've never experienced that before. And I always take my tell on this. Part of your paycheck doesn't matter how much you're paid, doesn't matter how little you're paid. Part of your paycheck is tolerating your co workers. They are paying you a fee to tolerate the people around you that you work with. If that fee is ever not enough for you to tolerate your co workers, you either a have to ask for a race to get more money to tolerate your coworkers, or b you leave and find coworkers you can tolerate for the amount you're paid. Right at should I love that you are. Not just paid to make the widget. You are paid to deal with Tom in accounting and Jerry over in advertising. All right, it's it's part of your pay. And I tell you what, some places play pay really really well, and they have really shitty people that work there. And several of my family members are discovering that, to their peril. Golden handcuffs do exist. Oh god, yes they do, dude, You and I. You and I talk very openly about like some of the absolutely just mind numbing bull crap. I tolerate for freaking money so I can continue to take care of my family. But you know what, philm that nice change, that nice chunk of change, and that retirement package. It is because you're telling me that if the pay was half what it was, you'd be dealing with it. That's what I thought. Damn Yeah, as much as half. Your paycheck might be a fine the company pays for. How stupid your coworkers are. Oh that where were you? Where were you all these years ago? That that perspective makes me feel so much better about my situation. I'm glad I could help. I really got that piece of advice from a co worker at my first job when I was thirteen. I need, we need to put that on a shirt. We do. I mean, Steve was Steve was a is. Actually I ran into him not that long. I'm amazed he still exists. With how much he smoked cigarettes. That guy smoked a lot of cigarettes. But that was a I had. I had a problem with one of the other older guys. He was very short with me all the time, and Steve pulled me aside and said, look, this is just how he is. This is just how he is. You can either accept that your paycheck pays for you to deal with him being an asshole, or you can go home your choices. I was like, Okay, I'm being paid to deal with an asshole. That's fine. But most money I'd ever made at that point. I mean, that's fair. I'm going to use I'm gonna abuse that saying from that one h a couple of comments to catch up on Rage was saying it was a mistake to suppress that speech at the dinner table. It was. I'll be real honest, like, I think that when you're talking about like in your workplace, you could make a really good argument for maybe not choosing violence all the time and like you know, modulating things a little bit in the name of your employment. But when you're talking about like dinner, table back, porch, front porch, friends and family, Like I can't speak for everybody else with the type of company y'all keep, but like when it comes to family, I kind of think I'm gonna say what I'm gonna say and as polite as I can manage, and if it bothers you that bad that you never want to see me again. We might have been blood, but we weren't family. Yeah, I mean at work, I will at work, I will speak slightly differently. I will be polite, I will be professional outside of work, when you're not paying me to be polite and professional, I will be as blunt as I feel I need to be. Jimminy Crickett is listening to you, just so you know she is. And she knows. I think we were dating for all of like three months before I told her mom off about something. You made it three months. I made it a full year. To be fair, I only spent like a couple hours with her parents at that point. Yeah, yeah, that's a whole nother I need to wait till the statute of limitations runs out of my in law as before I start telling all those stories. There you go. But as far as like that's family. Now, as far as friends, I'm gonna be real honest. If I invite you into my life, like if I've gone on vacation with you, if I've camped with you, if I talk to you on a regular basis, I kind of have a reasonable maybe not reasonable, I have an expectation that you're going to act like a reasonable human being and we can agree to disagree about the things we don't agree about, and if you disappoint me sufficiently, then I eject you from my life and never want to speak to you again. And it's not because we disagree, it's because we couldn't disagree respectfully. Yes, Because in my, in my weird, weird little worldview, the respect is the important part. Like you and I, you and I. Could have it out matter of fact. And I always use to the greatest example Eddie. Eddie and I offline, two of us, by ourselves have had some incredibly like forty five minute long debates about things, very passionate, very like, very you know, each equally educated in the subject from our own perspective, agreed about freaking nothing came away from his friends and said, hey, I don't. Agree with you. You don't agree with me. You know, time I've had a disagreement, disagreement with the guy, he's been respectable about it. And as long as as long as that is the perspective I come away from, I can continue to call a person friend when we have nothing in common. Man of my wedding disagrees with me politically about just about everything except firearms. He's really into firearms. Too, but we can hit into unregistered ghost guns. No, he's into mousers, which is cool. I guess he's a Millserp. He's definitely a Millserp guy. I don't even know if he has an AAR yet. He's in Wisconsin so he can. But I'm sorry, but like that there there are. There are definitely two different kinds of gun owners. And I am the should be able to buy RPGs out of vending machines type, and if you're not, that's fine, that's cool. Just understand that there are two kinds of gun owners. That's true, and they can choose not to use the vending machine. You don't have to buy, yes, but very very often that the second type of gun owner doesn't want the vending machine to exist. At all, So you know, boo boo. Anyway, raggle, that's how you pass values down for one generation to the next. It is. I will say that one of the frustrations and joys of having children is making peace with the fact that my child and I will not agree on everything. And I don't know if I want her to, like I've I've set for years that like my goal was to teach her how to think, not what to think, And as a result, I have to kind of like be at peace with the fact that she's going to make her own decisions, come to her own opinions, and. We're not gonna agree on everything. And that's cool. But it does my heart good when she and I can go like toe to toe in an intellectual discussion, disagree about everything, but she doesn't. She doesn't back down, she doesn't resort to parsonal attacks, she doesn't resort to emotion. She just defends her points. So it's like, okay, intellet right there. Even though we don't agree, and even though I questioned some of the things you're portraying as fact, at least you thought this through enough to get to the point where you can go, like head to head with. A grown adult, you can defend your stance. YEP, I can respect somebody that has done the due diligence stuff to defend their stance beyond Yeah, but it's a good thing. Yeah, as long as you're not taken your whole opinion straight to have a TikTok feed like. I feel like there's there's been some progress made. I did have one coworker that I just I just could not stand. He was one of those guys that thought he was going to create a free energy machine and that the government was trying to kill him with Apache helicopters. Not the craziest conspiracy theory I've ever heard. You couldn't You couldn't pay me enough to work with that guy. And I told my boss, and I said, you can't pay me enough to work side by side with that guy. I have to be in a different department. Apparently your boss agreed. He did. I got more, but that's okay. He left. I'm still there. It worked out, worked out for the best. H see here, Jeff Jack. Fortunately I'm paid enough to deal with the fact that day shift has a collective IQ of fifty six. I mean, hell, that's a. I mean freezing, that's above freezing. As a day shift myself, I have to say third shift is always responsible for all the crashes. Yeah, Raggle says day shift is stupid and night shift is lazy. This is the way of the world. And Raggle thinks your coworkers sound delightful. Might have an interesting fellow. I might have used the word entertaining, maybe not delightful. Yeah, he was entertaining for sure. And Jeff saying I'm convinced that no politsist, religion or money at the dinner table is a government plot to make teachers the only ones to talk to your kids about it. It has to do with all right, So where etiquette at the dinner table came from was European court politics and the acceptable and unacceptable things to discuss at a proper dinner table. It wasn't meant to be like at your house having dinner with your family. It was at the high table these things are not discussed. Which makes sense when you consider the fact that a lot of those customs are rooted in communal eating, like dining great dining halls where if you started talking about controversial subjects at the dining hall, it would evolve into a melee. You don't besmirch the king when he's sitting five seats down, well you and there's a guard behind you with a sword. Well that end. You don't besmirch someone when their actions could cause the entire hall to erupt into violence, and the next thing, you know, everybody unique guarding the gate is injured. Yeah, it's there's a certain there's a certain point at which that makes sense in a communal perspective. And I get it, you know it. But I think that, like a lot of things with etiquette, it can be taken way way too far, and it does get taken way too far. And you see, I don't. I just I don't completely agree with Jeff about one thing. Like I don't I think if I think if everyone played by those same rules that like in these arenas discussing controversial subjects or out of bounds, but in these other arenas it's acceptable. I feel like if everyone played by the same rules, then that would work. And like hear me out, I'm thinking to. Myself, like for a long time, and I'm kind of thinking that, like if we all agree left right center everybody. In these situations, like let's say it's dinner table and work, you don't talk about these things, and that's cool where nobody get nobody gets to talk about those things. But in these other situations, we talk about these things respectfully, We debate, and we have discourse. I feel like a lot of the problem is more the fact that, like within the no go places, one side decided this is a perfect place to talk about these things and get our opinion shoved in there, and the other side didn't respond to it. And then in the places where you're allowed to have these discussions, the same side who just a minute ago was saying we're going to stick it where it doesn't belong, start saying we're not going to allow the other side to get involved in this debate so that our opinion is the only one getting propagated. I feel like it's it was never as much a case of I feel like it was never as much of a case of things weren't spoken about that should have been, as the armistice that made these these social conventions work was broken. Yes, absolutely, I mean, look at it's like mustard gas in World War One. The first person to use it got a pretty good edge for a minute, and they did. But now everybody's starting to discuss it everywhere, which I think is a positive because we need that cultural pushback. We need to find that nice or that balance where we can where we can disagree but not consider half of our country our enemy. And I think that's also part of the problem, though, is that. I've kind of notoriously said for years and addiately it was very it was major hyperbole when I said it, but I said for a long time that like, conservatives are going to lose until we stop giving a shit. If we're likable or not. Yes, exactly, We're going to. Lose until we stop being polite. Because I was as a young man in my twenties, I was looking at the landscape around me and I'm like, everywhere conservatives go, they get their asses handed to them in debates because they get shadowed down by the earth, they get talked over, they get heckled, and they just don't do anything they just said. Then you get crowder Milo Shapiro, not that I like the guy, but Nick Fuentes, Yeah, he gets a lot of traction. Donald Trump gets a lot of traction for not being polite calling Roso Donald a fat peg and then doubling down on it is probably the single most memorable part of that year. Well, there was a lot of memorable parts of the year. But I guess my point is like. I don't know, man, that I still see that get passed around. And how long has it been. I mean he lost a presidential election in between winning two. Yeah, so it's been at least what ten probably twelve, ten twelve years since that happened. Well, probably ten. I think that's kind of my perspective though, is like, I haven't he's not even a conservative. Oh god, no, he's He's Bill Clinton the nineteen nineties. Yeah, I mean certainly. Except all we all knew from the start he was going after the hookers. Yeah, oh trust me. I was literally trying to find a way to make a meme that wouldn't get me banned off the internet, which was like a picture of Donald Trump. And is like, you hate him because he's literally hitler. I don't like him because he's literally Bill Clinton resurrected. He is. Although to be fair, Bill Clinton did some things economically that weren't that positive for the US at the time, and he deported a lot more people than Trump. So what you're tell me is the parallels are kind of self evident. No, I'm saying Trump's not doing a good enough job at deporting people. But my point is the parallels are self evident. Oh yeah, they definitely are. So my aggravation is that, you know, the Orange Republican is not conservative enough, and other people's aggravation is that. I don't know, he's not. Mao's a doong best I can tell correct. Yeah, well, actually I don't know that my is liberal enough for the liberals now, because Mao killed a lot of gays, yes, and a lot of gays. And continues to persecute religious minorities. Oh I'm not thinking now, I'm thinking of Jijingping. Yeah. Well, Xijingping also killed a number of gays back during the revolution, yes, or was responsible in part for their deaths. Still committing, still committing genocide on marginalized populations to this day. Literally concentration camps full of persecuted religious minorities. Hitler, anyone, I mean, come on, you got it right there. It's not even a stretch. It's as wild to me. But look, the more you the more you learn about history, the more frustrating current events become. Well, I and I think that that could be said going back into history as far as we have written records. Yeah, because these. The humans have not changed that much since we invented writing. They really have not. I literally broke a college a college professor's heart because I told her. That I did. I was of the opinion that human beings had not evolved appreciably beyond our animal state. Yeah. I think that's true. I think that's fairly accurate. I think if you took a hunter gatherer human, taught them English, like any of the pick, any of the hominids, even in the Angertal, teach them English, drop them in the US, I bet their behavior is not that dissimilar to what we have now. There might be some small outliers. I actually went the opposite direction and said that if you took like your average, your average, you know, post colonial, post industr realized member of society, and you put them in a primitive survival situation where it was kill or die, that they'd revert back to a primitive animal state within days. I mean, Somalia, anyone. I was thinking post I was thinking. Like, you know, the middle East Katrina. I was thinking New Orleans after a major hurricane, but. New York after Hurricane Sandy, there was some gang violence going on. I mean, look at modern day gang violence that is tribal warfare, re skinned over the drug trade instead of hunting rights. Yeah, it's. As much as we like to have all these high ideals, people are animals and the unless somebody is holding themselves to a higher standard, they will default to their baser nature. That's what I told a cultural anthropologists professor, and she I think I saw her dying side. Probably because look, I mean, there's a lot of fancy shit we do. It looks really different. Have you seen the clay tablet translation fill of the copper review? Mm hmm, so there is a there is a clay tablet from I believe it's a conuniform tablet where a customer is writing a review of some or sending a complaint letter about some bad ten or copper or that they were shipped from a guy, and the the only historical note of that copper merchant is this one complaint. Letter, the single one star review. El Nasar yep el Nasar. He is only known for history of having shipped a bad batch of copper, one bad batch of cop and if you read the translation of that, it sounds like a terrible Yelp review of a restaurant. It's hilarious, you guys, gotta go look it up. It's great. Obviously, Raggle hangs out in cooler, cooler parts of Reddit than I do. Yeah, it it comes up all the time in various suburn it's it comes up sometimes on Instagram. It's it's pretty great. Oh apparently there were several bad review tablets. That's awesome, But what are you gonna do? I mean it. Yeah, people people in the Greek and Roman era were discussing, we're bemoaning the weakness of the modern youth, the weakness and laziness of the modern youth, and how they're spoiled by modernity, like. By the saying by the same people doing the complaining, right. Yeah, yeah, oh yeah. It is one for one, how the boomers talked about my generation and your generation, and it's word for word how a lot of my generation talks about the younger group. And I'm like, you guys, you bitched about this then, and you're doing the exact same thing now. So the question remains how how does a person decide whether to advocate or whether to protect their anonymity with the understanding that like agree or disagree Like I firmly believe that if you if you advocate for something, you are in some way hanging a target on your back. Like how big of a target depends on how publicly you're advocating. In the case of you know, micro celebrities on social media, that can be a fairly wide reaching target. It can. I mean, all it would take is somebody with a much larger following than us taking a clip out of the show, out of context, blasting it out for one or both of us to become a pariah to variety of groups of people. I'm sure there are things that I have said that that could probably get some people very riled up and angry at me. Yeah, Ragle, that's a good point. How much do you have to lose now? Are you willing to lose it? And do you believe in your conviction strongly enough to risk it? I'll say this, if you're in North Korea, I probably would not besmirch the Kim family all that much because your life literally hangs in the balance. We are fortunate enough to live in a place where you will get a public shaming. It's probably the worst you're gonna get. I've been publicly shamed before, it didn't particularly bother me. It's probably not gonna bother me that much later. Yeah, I think my frustration has always just been the fact that, like, maybe I'm unique in this, maybe I'm not. I can't say I've ever felt public shame for something I said that I expected to get mad. People attempt to publicly shame me. But I think that's my point is that if I if I say, you know, I was talking about talking about like looney lefties or you know, any of a variety of political social topics, I pretty much like say what I'm gonna say, and then. You can attempt to public shame me. But I have to feel shame in order to feel shame, and I don't because I said it, I meant it so like buzz. Off, Yeah, I'm yeah. If you're not ashamed of what you're what you're saying, that the that just doesn't really work when they try. But you know, the one thing we haven't talked about in all this is when you get blindsided by it, Because there have been times and you and I've talked about this years and years ago before the gung community had their great epiphany that, you know, maybe we need to take a little bit of a different point of view if we were ever going to make these politicians shut the hell up about you know, our rights for five seconds. And I've said quite a number of things that I didn't think were controversial, and based on how the gun community reacted, apparently they were things like we should be able to buy you know, RPG's at of ending machines, and there should be no anafe and there should be no you know, like we should be able to I should be able to take a shotgun and saw the freaking barrel down to two inches of my garage, And what the. Hell does the government have to say about it? And how dare the government force me to submit to a background check to. Exercise a constitutional right? And how dare the law be set up in such a way that your average police officer with a freaking high school whole education, hopefully a high school education, can have a freaking full auto short barrel machine gun in the back of his cruiser. But I have to beg the crown and pay thousands of dollars for the same privilege like those were all statements I made back then, and it was the mainstream gun owner that clutched their pearls the tightest and was the most vociferously against the things I was saying. And that's the thing we haven't talked about that shocked me the most was if I were in a group of anti gun people made these statements, I expect people to get upset. I hope you get upset. Pile the shame on if you think you can figure out how to shame me for the things I say, because I meant them. But it was when I wasn't expecting the shame and I wasn't expecting the reaction, And that's when I got surprised the most, because I said things I thought in the presence of like friendly ears, and I found out very quickly that even in a group I consider myself to be a member of, I was all of a sudden the fringe element. I don't think you can prepare for that, because it's almost like an unanticipated betrayal. But I think that you do need to speak out, especially in groups where you I feel like you are one of the crowd, because it serves as a reality check to yourself of well, do I really believe this? You know what I mean? And you evaluated that and thought, no vending machines, that is the correct answer, and you know what, good if you can't take a critical look at your own beliefs and your own statements and say, Okay, yeah, maybe I went too far in that one, or no, that wasn't going far enough. We're going further because upon further reflection, you're all wrong. And I was wrong because I didn't go far enough. And I think that's kind of where I get bound up sometimes. That's where this whole discussion about do I ad cateror do I hold my tongue really falls apart, because like for me personally and somebody all out there might be the same, but like a lot of times, my problem is I believe in the principle of something to such a degree I don't know how to compromise on it, Like the whole RPGs have a vending machine thing. I've had this debate with people that are like, well, you can't honestly think that just everybody should have guns, Like what about what about the mental ill? What about this? What about that? And I'm like, if they're if the if if if. You trust them to walk amongst the streets with driver's license, yes, then then I trust them to have all the rights and privileges everyone else does until they do something stupid. But the trick is do you trust them to vote? Because that's voting. You could be voting with a nuke and President does have the football. And at the same time, I always fall back on this on the the the saying that I love the most. At any given time, an opposing party is welcome to resort to violence as long as you understand that I'm probably better at than you are. Yep. And that's kind of why. That's kind of why I believe the way I do about like firearms ownership or you know, people being able to freely carry firearms. If you have a gun and I have a gun, I'm not concerned. We're on equal footing. I like my odds. I don't like my wife's odds versus a six foot four, two hundred and fifty pound bodybuilder. She has a gun. I can tell you that my wife and I have wrestled enough that I think I've firmly made that point with her that like, you're not Oh yeah, you're not handing any grown man the business, honey. I had. I had a girlfriend in high school that grew up with all female cousins and all sisters. And was she one of the ones that thought you could talk your way out of anything. She thought for sure that she had watched enough action movies that she could kick the ass of just about anyone. And I said that, why is it that people that have never practiced the use of violence are always the ones that insist it's never an option, it's never the answer. Yeah, or or at the very least that they would be unconscionably good at the application. Is this like the discussion we had about training not too long ago, where it was like, what, why would you think you will suddenly rise to the miraculously rise to the occasion to do something you've never practiced doing. Before, because the only thing the media has ever shown you is heroes rising to the occasion. Ugh, we need more movies. Think, think about it. All of our childhood, what did you see? You saw spy kids, the kids with no training at all suddenly becoming super spies. But wait, saving Private Ryan. Whole, Frigain whole friagain Squad Army Rangers, every last one of them dead and dye by the end of the show. True that I think. I think that is the first movie I saw that was a like cultural touchstone that showed the reality of that. And while we're at it, black Hawk Down, you know, I I don't know if that was as big of a cultural touchstone as Saving Private Ryan. Thirteen Hours. I've never seen thirteen Hours. I should probably watch it. I will just say before I move the move the ball a little bit like thirteen hour, you would probably really enjoy thirteen Hours. I probably would if if you're putting it in those in that same category. It's a very different type of movie than Saving Private Ryan. It's I don't know, like as a combat veteran, there are parts of it there very. Hard for me to watch. I would believe that, you know, I have heard the same thing about Saving Private Ryan. I've heard the same thing about Hacksaw Ridge. They're parts of Saving Private Ryan that like genuinely bring tears to my eyes because, like for those of es that serve in combat, some of those things you see, you put yourself mentally in that situation and think to yourself like, if that was me and my buddy, I'd be having a bad day. Yeah, But in a. Case, we got totally off off the topic the way over here. And I have no idea how we got here. Well, I think that it comes down to a cost benefit analysis. This whole topic comes down to a cost benefit analysis. Is it going to cost you more than you are willing to pay? And I think for a very long time, the amount of people were willing to pay on the conservative event to talk about their beliefs has been extremely little. And that's rapidly gone away, especially in the Second Amendment community, especially in the anti abortion community, especially in the religious community. I'm seeing a lot more people very rapidly advocating for their Christian conservative beliefs. And you know, I'm not a religious person. I'm not. I have said that before on this show, and I've had discussions with my wife lately where I've said, honestly, I'm might be wrong about not being religious, because clearly the rest of the world can't handle their shit without Sky Daddy holding a sword over their head. I mean, oh, God, or you and I ever going to have the religion the religion episode, how would we even do that. With at least two glasses of bourbon the piece. Okay, that that, well, we'll pocket that one. That might be a Patriot only episode, but we'll pocket that one. We're both intoxicated. We should definitely do it as a Patriot only episode and a pre record so that in case it goes way too off the rails, we can edit it. Oh hell no, I don't. I don't edit. I don't edit ahead of the Patroon episodes. We actually haven't. We actually have not done like a dedicated for the Patron's rand infects episode in a while, and now is definitely not the time to do it, because as it is tomorrow night, we're doubling up because I got to get one in the pocket for the next couple of weeks of my life that are going to be insane. But family do be like that sometimes. Yeah, But I mean to your point about the cost benefit analysis before we roll this out, I don't think it was just I don't think it was just a cost problem, like conservatives weren't willing to pay the toll. I think the problem is they didn't see any benefit like this is. This has been the argument I've made about like people that are anti gun people. That are most people that I. Meet that are ideologically opposed to the civiling ownership ownership of firearms, like on a principal basis. Their problem is they see the cost, as they see it, of sibuting gunnership. There is there are, there is violence that involves firearms. People are in jure blah blah blah, but they don't see any benefit to balance out the other side of the scale. I look at it from a historical perspective and say, every time the government are the only people that have guns, really. Bad shit happens after that. So the benefit to subulting gunnership is that we don't get We don't become stalin you know stall In Russia, or Mauzadong China, or the you know the Khmer Rousion Cambodia. We don't those current day China. Yes, we don't do any of those things. We don't allow the genocide against people because the people have a lot more guns than the government does. He look at our own country's history with the Native Americans, Yeah, there were laws against selling them firearms. Too, and African Americans. The only historical basis we have for firearms regulation in this country are slave codes. Yep. What does that tell you? Right there? Tells me that the there was an ardent interest in making sure that people that might want to shoot you for doing bad stuff to them don't have the guns to shoot. You, instead of just not doing bad things to the people. That's very high mind, so far out of your way to just not be a dick. But my point is that's the problem. That's where I see anti gun people like get stuck, is there's all this cost, there is no benefit. Therefore guns are net negative period discussion, and I think that was the problem Stewart. I got you to click on the wrong one. Stuart, we're not starting over. You should listen to it though. It's been a really fun conversation and we did lots of entering. But I think the problem for conservatives for a lot of years, what kept conservatives as a large group quiet was that they saw. The cost being social ostracism and public. Shame, and they didn't see a benefit to it. Like the idea was the idea that I grew up with was that well, conservatives are logical, rational, We're right, you know, our ideas are better, so we'll win, and we as a group continue to get our assts handed to us in the court of public opinion over and over and over, and it didn't matter how right we thought we were. We kept losing because we would. Because the populace at large are not rational actors. And so I think that's the parallel. Though mobs are not rational actors. But I think that's the parallel. For too many years, conservatives said there's a cost, there's no benefit. I'm just gonna let it slide. And I think, and I think now that the Overton window has gotten pulled as hard as it did to the left, now our generation but downside, and now our generation of conservatives are grabbing the our side of the Overton window, and Yankee it as hard to the right as humanly possible, saying no, there is a cost, and the cost is this, and the cost is this and this, and it's my culture being disintegrated. It's my ideas being tread under. It's my rights being taken away from me. It's the government choosing winners and losers when their job was to make the playing field level in the first place. I'm not cool with this. I can see the call lost involved in keeping quiet and the benefit is I can see the benefit to speaking up is that my voice gets heard, and therefore the cost is now justified. I think that's the difference between our parents' generation of conservatives and our generation of conservatives. We are finally realizing what they never did, which is being quiet does cost something to. It does the cost is too damn high to being quiet. Yeah. So anyway, that. Is some version of a debate that I have with myself when I first started this podcast ten years ago this August. It's a version of a debate I have with myself occasionally. It's it is still to this day, the thing that I ask myself when I have a moment to think and breathe, and I'm like, wow, I really thought this was a great idea, and I guess in most ways it was, but. I don't know. Look looking back on it, Oh, it's been a hell of a lot of fun. I've met a lot of really cool, interesting people. Doing this podcast. I mean, I've I met you, for one. But at the same time I look back at it and think to myself, I'm like, did I did I truly understand what I was risking by putting my face and my full name on the Internet and saying take a shot at you, take a shot at me. If you think you got one. No, I don't think you did. I don't think any of us really do, because the retaliation that you can get for putting yourself out there can be quite extreme. Yeah, and fortunately or not fortunately unfortunately, however you want to look at it. We've mostly had positive interactions with people for the most part, and I think that's because your original because the original mission statement for this podcast from you has always been how do we help people help themselves to some extent? Yeah, not always going to go on what is helpful, but you know, God is trying, freaking Stewart. I usually do you take a shot at the Talabama recruiter look alike? Well, I mean, fair enough, he's just jealous of my beard, he is. And in addition to a Bourbon sponsor, I apparently also need a beard oil sponsor. So you know, beard oil does have a price tag on it. I mean, I have a brand, and I really like that brand. And if they were to reach out and say, hey, we love sponsor your show. There's now two of us on the show with beards, so we could probably make something happen. That's true. There was two of you on the show with beards originally. Yeah, but he had his own brand, and I didn't like his brand because I don't care for the smell. I'm not particularly settled on any particular brand. Okay, So Nick's wide open and I have my preference, but no one's reaching out sponsors for beard oil. So you know, I sent my wife out to the store and said I require beard oil, and she brought it back and it smells nice. I'm gonna shoot her a message and to turn her on some stuff that if she likes the smell of it, you're gonna wear it. This is accurate. Yes, that's usually how it works. I keep the beard because my wife likes it. Like look, I'm the only kind of peer pressure that works really well on me is coming from either my wife or my grandma one because my grandma has been known to swing a shovel quite hard and is very good at baked goods. And my wife is also very good at baked goods and can probably also swing a shovel. She has yet to swing a shovel at me on purpose, so we shall see. Yeah, I'm gonna send her a message about beard oil. And swing and shovels, but this might be painful. We'll go ahead and wrap this one up. I will tell y'all now because y'all will be so right now is the twenty sixth of February. Y'all will be watching this tonight and hearing this on the twenty eighth Saturday morning when it goes out March twelfth. And I'm gonna say it now, and Nick, I'm asking you to help me remember to say it on the episode we record tomorrow, but I'll probably forget. That episode will be pre recorded. You are all welcome to come into the comments like usual and antagonize each other. Unfortunately, Nick and I will not be able to hear you because we will that episode will be pre recorded, and I'm just telling y'all now in case I forget to record it on the show tomorrow. I don't know. I don't like pre recording. We remember halfway through the show to remind you to say it's a pre record. That's better than neither one of us remembering. But I mean, personally, I don't care for pre recording. I enjoy the audience interaction, even Stewart browbeating me about you know, being a talliban recruiter looklike. But in this case, it's kind of a necessity. Yeah, pre record live, Stuart, I don't know how on earth we would do pre recorded live. Well, you could just live stream when we're recording ahead of time and then put it up later. Yeah, but then they didn't know. That feels weird because then it's it's been floating around out there for like two weeks before it goes out to audio. That's just right. It's gonna throw it's gonna throw things off. You'll throw off full of Phil's function. Way. Okay. So I don't know if anybody's been around long to remember, but I actually tried this a long time ago where there was a time years ago I think Andrew and I were still recording together. I actually like pre recorded an episode. Actually know, Andrew and I pre recorded a couple of episodes because like that was like right before he had the egsit the show and his schedule got really weird. So we recorded like two or three shows in advance. That way, if you couldn't make an any particular day, I already had content. We just kind of stayed a and a week ahead, and then at some point I lost a whole episode that we pre recorded just forgot to post it. And I found it like five months later, which is a little frustrating because I am hyper organized. It's part of my you know, hyperfixation and autism, and I just lost it. It was uploaded into our podcasting interface. It was just sitting there and draft And that's probably why I lost it, because it wasn't like, it wasn't on my hard drive where I have things nice and you know, lined up. And ready to go. But I put it out there so that if worse, I always kept one episode in the interface. That way, if like something happened, I could literally just jump on with my phone and just kick it in, you know, just publish it from my phone. Yeah, and then I lost it. Five months later. I was like, whoops, oh look a Patreon drop. Yeah, anyway, let's go ahead and wrap this one up. I gotta take a shower. I got another crap. I'm going to hassle you about a Patreon episode though. Once things gets settled, given a month or so, you know what, get into summer. That weekend, that weekend, and a couple of weeks after the thing I have to do that might be a nice quiet weekend, do a patron only episode. We can do that. We'll figure it out, all right, absolutely, matter of fact is going to go out the door. Just remember, whenever we have this conversation about whether you be an advocate or you protect your anonymity, I believe you have a responsibility to advocate for the things you hold. In your dear to your heart. And yes, there very well might be a cost involved in speaking up, but there will also be a cost involved in. Not speaking up. So you decide which cost you're willing to pay and which one hurts your pocket, your your emotional, social, you know, social pocketbook the least. And I'll talk to you'all another week. Bye, everybody, night, Bertiner.