Raising Values: Silence is Golden

[00:00:01] Welcome to the Raising Values Podcast, where the traditional family talks. You can find us on iTunes, Stitcher, and Spotify, and be sure to follow us on Facebook and Instagram. You can support the Raising Values Podcast through Patreon. Phil and Gillian are behind the mic, and we hope you enjoy the show.

[00:00:29] We're flirting. You just give us a second.

[00:00:33] Good morning. He said he was going to be weird today, and I was like, you're never weird.

[00:00:38] Well, that's because like right before we started you said don't be weird.

[00:00:44] Okay. I don't know what was wrong with the camera, but Phil just...

[00:00:47] It's not pointed right.

[00:00:49] It's fine. Okay, let's get started. Good morning and welcome to Raising Values. You know who I am. I'm Gillian. This is Phil who's not going to be weird. I'm the weird one.

[00:00:59] Didn't you tell me the last time like why do we introduce ourselves because everybody knows who we are?

[00:01:03] I know, but then wait, what did I say?

[00:01:06] You told me I shouldn't feel like we have to introduce ourselves to the audience every time.

[00:01:11] No, but we should. I don't know why I said that because that's really not smart to do because you never know when we have new listeners or when somebody just stumbles across the podcast and they're like, oh, who are these folks?

[00:01:23] Even though they may not, they're not going to stumble in right at the time we introduce ourselves.

[00:01:27] So I was right?

[00:01:28] No.

[00:01:28] So...

[00:01:29] Morning, Stuart.

[00:01:31] Oh my gosh, I'm waiting. God, you're so demanding, Stuart.

[00:01:36] And he started on YouTube and then jumped over to Facebook.

[00:01:38] I know. 10 minutes, 11 minutes ago. Anyway, good morning. We have a show today, of course.

[00:01:47] We have things to talk about.

[00:01:49] We have a show. Things to talk about. And this one kind of came from something that happened over the week with me and Piper.

[00:01:58] Something happened, not between us, but something happened to us.

[00:02:02] So I thought we would talk about that.

[00:02:04] But first, obviously, stuff we have to get out of the way.

[00:02:08] New merch, obviously. Here it is.

[00:02:11] First of all, I'm a delight. I am a delight.

[00:02:13] I wasn't a delight yesterday. I was in a really bad mood yesterday.

[00:02:18] But I fed her a steak and that fixed everything.

[00:02:21] I was hangry. I was hangry. And that... Make no apologies. You know I get hangry.

[00:02:30] Sorry, not sorry. Anyway, so new merch. You can go. It's in the show notes.

[00:02:37] Southern...

[00:02:39] Southern Gals Crafts.

[00:02:40] Southern Gals Crafts. I always want to say Southern Crafts Gals.

[00:02:43] But that doesn't make any sense.

[00:02:45] Southern Gals Crafts. You can look up the merch and everything else.

[00:02:49] For our patrons that are listening.

[00:02:51] So because we didn't go to Prepper Camp, we didn't get to see all of our friends.

[00:02:56] And we didn't get to see the patrons that attend and all that stuff.

[00:03:01] We need to give y'all... We need to get y'all your stickers.

[00:03:06] So shoot us a message or an email or whatever with your address.

[00:03:10] And we can send y'all your stickers.

[00:03:12] Because we had a lot of stuff made for Prepper Camp.

[00:03:15] We had a lot of like... I made a banner that was taller than me.

[00:03:19] Maybe we'll use it.

[00:03:21] But we have some ideas coming up soon in the next few months that we'll use the banner for.

[00:03:27] But yeah, we have stickers and all that stuff.

[00:03:30] We did have some giveaways that we were going to give away at Prepper Camp.

[00:03:35] I guess if you're maybe the first five that send us a message, we'll send something extra with your stickers.

[00:03:43] How about that?

[00:03:45] Okay.

[00:03:46] Okay.

[00:03:47] This wasn't pre-discussed to me.

[00:03:49] I don't know where she's going.

[00:03:52] Okay.

[00:03:53] I'm making it weird.

[00:03:55] Okay.

[00:03:56] So the other things.

[00:03:57] What other things are there?

[00:03:59] Is that it?

[00:04:00] Raising values.

[00:04:01] Oh, the signal chat for patrons.

[00:04:02] Which is a good way to get a hold of us if you'd like to talk to us about something.

[00:04:06] Yeah.

[00:04:07] The raising values signal chat.

[00:04:08] But Stuart actually just posted in there a couple of days ago about our annual Secret Santa that we do for patrons.

[00:04:19] He does.

[00:04:19] He does that.

[00:04:21] He is the Secret Santa.

[00:04:24] So if you are a patron or want to become a patron and you want to get in on the Secret Santa stuff,

[00:04:30] it's always fun to have something mailed to you from kind of a stranger.

[00:04:36] You may not have ever met these people.

[00:04:38] Stop looking at me like that.

[00:04:39] I got a buck knife and a roll of toilet paper last year.

[00:04:42] It's that kind of group.

[00:04:44] I got a She-Wee.

[00:04:47] It's one of those hiking, when you're going hiking and you got to use the bathroom and you're a girl

[00:04:55] and you can't stand up to use the bathroom kind of thing.

[00:04:58] I don't remember who my Secret Santa was.

[00:05:00] I don't remember either, but that was like a genuinely useful gift.

[00:05:05] Yeah.

[00:05:05] Because we've been hiking before.

[00:05:07] Or we've been hiking before.

[00:05:09] And like, you know, mile and a half back on the trail, somebody's got to go.

[00:05:14] Yeah.

[00:05:15] So anyway, it's fun stuff.

[00:05:17] We always have fun stuff going on.

[00:05:21] So again, good morning to everyone.

[00:05:23] Stuart, we just talked.

[00:05:24] There's got to be a delay because we just talked about the Secret Santa.

[00:05:30] We're on it.

[00:05:31] We got you.

[00:05:31] We got you, boo.

[00:05:33] So anyway, so Silence is Golden.

[00:05:36] That is the name of the show today.

[00:05:40] And to kind of give a backstory of what happened, because there's always a backstory.

[00:05:46] Piper and I were leaving school after Caroline a couple of days ago.

[00:05:50] And a lot of things going on at school right now.

[00:05:54] We had our fall picnic.

[00:05:55] We had the book fair.

[00:05:57] We had Boosterthon.

[00:05:58] We had all sorts of things happening at school.

[00:06:00] And so I walk over because I help with the book fair.

[00:06:05] And two of my coworkers are there.

[00:06:07] They're absolutely the sweetest people.

[00:06:10] And I love them to death.

[00:06:12] They have been some of the best mentors that I've had in this profession.

[00:06:17] But they are old school.

[00:06:22] And they started making comments about Piper's weight and appearance.

[00:06:32] And you could tell she was totally uncomfortable.

[00:06:35] I'm totally uncomfortable about it because it kind of triggers something in me.

[00:06:42] I hate using the word trigger, but it does trigger something in me.

[00:06:45] Because weight and appearance was always talked about in my house.

[00:06:50] Always.

[00:06:51] It was always commented on, oh, you're getting a little chubby.

[00:06:53] Oh, you're getting a little too thin.

[00:06:57] I mean, my mom just harped on our appearances.

[00:07:01] And it wasn't just her.

[00:07:02] It was just that generation, I don't know why.

[00:07:07] Maybe someone older listening to the show can help.

[00:07:10] But commenting on people's appearances was just a thing, especially girls, I feel like.

[00:07:17] So I kind of got triggered a little bit and very uncomfortable.

[00:07:21] And I was like, God, you know, don't talk about her appearance.

[00:07:26] So Piper is getting much taller.

[00:07:29] Um, she's going to be, I think she's going to be taller than me.

[00:07:33] She might be Phil's height.

[00:07:34] I don't know.

[00:07:34] She might be a little bit taller.

[00:07:35] I mean, I come from a family of six feet women.

[00:07:38] So she may have gotten that gene.

[00:07:41] Anyway, she's almost 13.

[00:07:43] So she's growing.

[00:07:44] Things are changing.

[00:07:44] Her body's looking different.

[00:07:46] All those things that come with being a teenager.

[00:07:50] And poor thing.

[00:07:51] So they're saying, oh, mama, look at her.

[00:07:54] She's getting so skinny.

[00:07:55] She's losing all that baby weight.

[00:07:58] Look at her face.

[00:07:58] I mean, they just kept going and going and going.

[00:08:01] And I look at Piper and she goes, and one of them said something to her.

[00:08:05] Um, and she looks at me and she goes, I'm ready to go home.

[00:08:09] And I was like, I know, like, come on, let's go.

[00:08:13] Like, we're out of here.

[00:08:14] Like, so we're walking out.

[00:08:16] And because I am who I am.

[00:08:19] And I always feel like I have to say something.

[00:08:22] I kind of pull her to the side a little bit.

[00:08:24] And I was like, I'm very sorry that happened.

[00:08:26] I'm very sorry that they commented on your weight and commented on your body.

[00:08:30] And, you know, it couldn't have happened at a worse time too.

[00:08:34] Because right now in science, they're calculating body mass.

[00:08:38] And they're, you know, she's just in that weird spot where she's starting to become,

[00:08:46] I wouldn't say self-conscious, but she's starting to realize the changes that are happening.

[00:08:50] You know, we've all been there.

[00:08:54] And then all of a sudden, these two women start talking about her appearance and all that stuff.

[00:09:00] But in the last two weeks, three weeks, she has been very conscious about what she's eating.

[00:09:07] She's been very conscious about what me and Phil buy food-wise.

[00:09:10] She's downloaded this app where it gives the food a rating, zero to 100.

[00:09:18] And she's actually been really good at holding us accountable for this.

[00:09:22] And she's made rules.

[00:09:23] So anything 30 to 50, that rates a 30 to a 50, we can have occasionally.

[00:09:30] But if it's not 50 or above, we can't bring it into the house.

[00:09:35] And so here I am in the grocery store scanning everything.

[00:09:40] Scanning everything.

[00:09:41] Because I know what it's like.

[00:09:44] I know what it's like to be self-conscious.

[00:09:47] I know what it's like to be self-conscious of my body and my weight and everything.

[00:09:52] My hair color.

[00:09:53] My, you know, the zit on my face or whatever.

[00:09:56] I know what it's like to be a teenage girl.

[00:09:59] And if I can help her through that by doing some of these things, then absolutely.

[00:10:05] Because that wasn't an option for me.

[00:10:07] First of all, we didn't have cell phones with apps that you could scan barcodes and see how healthy it was.

[00:10:13] Because, you know, and second of all, you ate what you ate.

[00:10:17] And I grew up in the, well, I grew up in the kind of tail end of the TV dinner generation.

[00:10:26] So, you know, you were...

[00:10:28] Before we realized the USDA food pyramid was completely full of it.

[00:10:31] Right.

[00:10:32] And so, we would eat TV dinners at night.

[00:10:35] Or, you know, sometimes mom or dad would cook.

[00:10:37] And we didn't ever go out to eat.

[00:10:40] First of all, we lived in such a small town.

[00:10:41] There wasn't any restaurants to go out to eat.

[00:10:43] And second, there was no money.

[00:10:47] There was no money to go out to eat.

[00:10:49] We went out to eat occasionally.

[00:10:52] But now it's just everything is packaged.

[00:10:56] Everything is...

[00:10:58] Anyway, I'm not going to go down that road.

[00:11:00] Because I think that's a whole other show.

[00:11:02] But our food is not healthy.

[00:11:04] So, what she's asked us to do is to really start to become an ingredient household.

[00:11:08] Where we buy the ingredients to make the food.

[00:11:11] All for that.

[00:11:12] I think that's great.

[00:11:13] I mean, that just further puts us down the road of what Phil and I started over a year ago now.

[00:11:20] Of being health conscious.

[00:11:21] And what are we putting into our bodies.

[00:11:23] And, you know, all that stuff.

[00:11:24] And so, I don't care if I'm in the grocery store scanning barcodes to see what it scores on this app.

[00:11:33] And it does this app.

[00:11:34] I'm not going to tell you what the name is.

[00:11:35] If you want the name, you can message me or email me or whatever.

[00:11:40] But I'm not going to promote the app.

[00:11:43] Anyway, it doesn't just give you a score.

[00:11:45] It tells you why it gets the score.

[00:11:47] So, it's telling you things like, oh, it has too much sodium.

[00:11:51] Or this one has artificial dyes and color.

[00:11:53] Or this one has blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:11:55] Too much sugar.

[00:11:56] Too much, you know, it has corn syrup in it.

[00:11:58] Whatever.

[00:11:59] It tells you all those things.

[00:12:02] And one of the things that we have impressed upon her is this is great.

[00:12:06] This is a great guiding tool.

[00:12:09] But it's not the be-all, end-all.

[00:12:11] Because when you scan hamburger meat or you scan a steak, it's going to come back with a low score.

[00:12:16] And butter, all those fatty things, it's going to come back with a low score.

[00:12:21] And you need those things.

[00:12:23] Your body has to have those things.

[00:12:26] So, anyway, back to what this show is about.

[00:12:30] Silence is golden.

[00:12:32] When I texted Phil and I said, hey, I have a show idea.

[00:12:36] Because, like Stuart said, Mama Bear kind of came out in me.

[00:12:41] And, like I said, these women are mentors to me.

[00:12:44] I love them.

[00:12:45] And they were the first women that I ever came in contact with when I went to work at this school.

[00:12:50] And they've been there for over 20 years.

[00:12:52] So, I'm not going to say anything bad about them.

[00:12:57] I think it's just their upbringing.

[00:13:00] I think it's just their-

[00:13:01] Generationally.

[00:13:02] Generation.

[00:13:02] They-

[00:13:03] And I do think there is something to that.

[00:13:06] I think that the generation ahead of us did place more priority on appearance rather than things that we prioritize.

[00:13:13] Which, like I've told you for years, I didn't participate in us making these big dietary changes because of vanity.

[00:13:21] Like, I don't care if I-

[00:13:22] I care to a small degree whether or not I have a beer belly.

[00:13:26] I don't want to look like I'm in my third trimester.

[00:13:29] But the whole point of doing this wasn't to lose weight.

[00:13:32] The point was to get healthier, to get my blood sugar under control, to have, you know, to like-

[00:13:37] To improve my actual physical health so that I can be as physically active as I want to be.

[00:13:43] And that-

[00:13:44] That was the goal.

[00:13:45] So, whatever furthers that goal is what I'm going to do.

[00:13:48] And I feel like the generation ahead of us was much more concerned about, well, is it going to make me skinny?

[00:13:54] And my point of view is, is I'm like, who cares if you're skinny?

[00:13:58] If you can't-

[00:13:59] If you can't lift a bag of-

[00:14:00] If I can't lift a bag of concrete, I don't care how skinny I am.

[00:14:03] You know?

[00:14:04] If I can't go in the front yard and rip the brakes off the front of that truck or do-

[00:14:08] Rip the brakes off of your Jeep and do man stuff, forgive me for being misogynistic,

[00:14:12] for just second or sexist.

[00:14:14] Oh, stop.

[00:14:15] But, you know, if I can't go do those things, then I don't care how I look in my clothes.

[00:14:20] I don't care how thin I am or how, you know, how cut my body is.

[00:14:26] I don't care how much muscle I have if I can't do anything with it.

[00:14:29] Right.

[00:14:29] The point is to get to the end result, not to be decorative, I guess is my point.

[00:14:36] But I do- I do- I sense that from- and I can't say if it's like a whole generation thing or if it was just more prevalent in the generations ahead of us.

[00:14:46] But I feel a certain amount of that.

[00:14:48] I had this experience, not that it affects me to the degree it does- I feel like it does you and Piper, women in general.

[00:14:56] But, like, the first year I was working at my current job, we'd do this big potluck.

[00:15:00] We would do this big potluck for Thanksgiving and for Christmas.

[00:15:04] And at Christmas, I brought- I don't remember what.

[00:15:07] I made a plate, came back and visited the dessert table.

[00:15:10] And these two old women were like, you're hitting the dessert table a little hard there, aren't you?

[00:15:16] Wow.

[00:15:19] That's awful.

[00:15:19] Oh, God.

[00:15:21] Why did people- silence is golden.

[00:15:24] Just keep your mouth shut.

[00:15:26] Oh, well, but call it what it is.

[00:15:28] At this point in my life-

[00:15:29] Wifey bear wants to come out now.

[00:15:31] But at this point in my life, I'm 31 years old.

[00:15:34] I am by far in the best shape of everybody in this entire work unit.

[00:15:37] I'm the youngest, the most physically able, the strongest, the thinnest.

[00:15:41] And I'm still getting this from these two chubby old women that are in their 50s and 60s.

[00:15:47] And I just kind of laughed it off and said, well, you know, got a sweet tooth and went

[00:15:51] back to my desk.

[00:15:52] And my supervisor who had heard it came in, like, just to check and see because she could

[00:15:57] hear it in my voice that I was a little miffed.

[00:16:00] And she came and asked me and I was just like, it doesn't bother me that bad.

[00:16:05] The part of this that pisses me off is if I said that to the two of them, I'd have been

[00:16:09] drugged down to human resources for a sexual harassment claim.

[00:16:12] Yeah.

[00:16:12] That's the part of this that aggravates me is because it was two older women that did

[00:16:16] it.

[00:16:17] It's just, I'm expected as a man to just suck it up and deal with it, but it wouldn't

[00:16:21] be okay in reverse.

[00:16:22] And that's the part of that whole dynamic that aggravated me.

[00:16:26] But at the same time, like, you know, we went to see your sister and my brother-in-law

[00:16:31] a couple of years ago and Andrew, he looked down at my belly and said, damn, you put on

[00:16:35] a couple of pounds, huh?

[00:16:36] And you and Phoebe were just mortified.

[00:16:40] I thought y'all were bad.

[00:16:42] I'm still mortified.

[00:16:43] I still hold that over Andrew's head.

[00:16:45] But again, here's the thing of it though.

[00:16:49] If he were a random stranger on the street, it wouldn't be acceptable.

[00:16:54] But two men that know each other the way me and Andrew are, I feel like we can call each

[00:16:57] other out.

[00:16:58] You know what I'm saying?

[00:16:59] Like, dude, you need to tighten it up a little bit.

[00:17:01] It would be, if your sister felt like you were looking a little ratchet, wouldn't you

[00:17:08] hope she would like gently pull you aside and call you out and be like, Gillian, come on.

[00:17:14] So, okay, good example.

[00:17:16] My sister did text me last night.

[00:17:18] She sent me a picture of me and you at my grandparents' 60th wedding anniversary party.

[00:17:26] This was maybe seven years ago.

[00:17:32] I was about to say, this feels like this was about 10 years ago.

[00:17:35] Seven, 12.

[00:17:36] 12, um, what did I say?

[00:17:38] Seven, eight.

[00:17:39] It was about eight, eight, eight years ago.

[00:17:41] Um, and I, I don't, I don't look like that person anymore.

[00:17:48] Like, I don't look like that person.

[00:17:50] You're 40.

[00:17:51] Well, I understand.

[00:17:52] I understand.

[00:17:53] Why does my age matter?

[00:17:55] Because it's been eight years.

[00:17:57] I need to show you the picture.

[00:17:59] My age doesn't matter.

[00:18:01] My, the fact that I took my health back, I like, I have worked on my health.

[00:18:06] Um, but she wasn't like, she didn't text me in the picture and be like, um, damn girl,

[00:18:12] you were fat.

[00:18:14] You've put on a few pounds or whatever.

[00:18:16] She texted me and said, look at how far you've come.

[00:18:19] Look at how much hard work you've done.

[00:18:21] And, um, anyway, we kind of got into a whole conversation about that, but it wasn't a, well,

[00:18:28] you know, now that I, I'm sitting here saying that it was kind of the same way that these

[00:18:33] two women were commenting because that is the same, that is the same, um, uh, message

[00:18:42] that they were sending was look at how much different context though, because this, first

[00:18:47] of all, this was being done by your sister, not by peers at work.

[00:18:51] Right.

[00:18:51] And second of all, in private versus semi-public.

[00:18:54] Yeah.

[00:18:54] We were in the gym when they said all this to Piper, poor thing.

[00:18:58] God, I was just mortified for her.

[00:19:00] Um, and my heart just sank.

[00:19:01] It just broke because I, like I said, I've been there.

[00:19:05] I've, I've had my mother scrutinize my body and she still does.

[00:19:09] And then there was one time when we were at my parents' house and my mom made a comment

[00:19:14] about Piper's weight and not five minutes later we were leaving because.

[00:19:20] I was ready to snatch the lungs out of her chest over the.

[00:19:23] Yeah.

[00:19:23] And, and that's.

[00:19:24] She didn't hear it thankfully, but I was.

[00:19:26] Oh, I saw, I saw your face and I was like, oh, we better get out of here before my husband

[00:19:30] goes to jail because mama bear is not going to be nice, but daddy bear, papa bear is about

[00:19:38] to rip your trachea out of here.

[00:19:41] I mean, sometimes people just need, need to have an example made of them.

[00:19:45] That's all.

[00:19:46] Anyway.

[00:19:47] So that was my first thing was we, as a culture, as a society, as a, as just human beings have

[00:19:54] to stop discussing other people's appearances.

[00:19:59] Like we have to stop bringing nine times out of 10, 99 out of a hundred.

[00:20:06] That's the same ratio.

[00:20:08] 99.9.

[00:20:12] I'm trying.

[00:20:13] 99.9 times out of a hundred.

[00:20:18] That person is aware of what their body looks like.

[00:20:21] They've already scrutinized themselves for 30 minutes in the mirror that morning.

[00:20:24] They certainly don't need someone else to come in and say, oh, you're hitting the dessert

[00:20:28] table a little much today, or they don't need you to come in and say, look at all the, this,

[00:20:33] how skinny you're getting.

[00:20:34] Look, which implies you were fat or you implies that you were overweight or implies you were

[00:20:39] chubby or whatever.

[00:20:40] And even if the person didn't mean that inference, though, like to me, the whole point of a lot

[00:20:46] of this is to consider the fact that you, when you say these things, you might have totally

[00:20:51] innocent, altruistic, you know, feelings.

[00:20:56] But we've been on the other side of some of this and you don't know what's going on inside

[00:21:00] that person's head that colors that to make it feel like a backhand.

[00:21:04] Yeah.

[00:21:05] How hard the struggle has been.

[00:21:08] Yeah.

[00:21:08] Or how, like, cause you, you, it's not uncommon at any age for women to like, they could be

[00:21:18] absolutely drop dead 10 out of 10 beautiful and still all they see is their flaws.

[00:21:22] Yeah.

[00:21:23] Oh, I guarantee that most women, majority of women are looking in the mirror and they're

[00:21:30] not seeing how beautiful they are.

[00:21:31] It doesn't matter how many times you tell me how beautiful I am.

[00:21:34] It's frustrating.

[00:21:34] I'm still, I'm sorry.

[00:21:36] I'm still going to look in the mirror and go, oh, well, this is a little too bulgy over

[00:21:41] here or whatever.

[00:21:42] I'm just going to pick myself apart.

[00:21:45] And I would say that this applies to, this applies to men to a lesser degree as far as

[00:21:49] appearance because of like most of us growing up have had that experience of having to compare

[00:21:54] ourselves to our peers.

[00:21:55] And if you are the chubby kid, the skinny kid, the short kid, the kid that's like way

[00:22:00] taller than everybody else, like we, we notice those things.

[00:22:04] And there is a bit of insecurity amongst, I would say probably mostly amongst like pubescent

[00:22:10] boys.

[00:22:11] By the time most of us get to full blown adulthood, I feel like most of us get past that, but not

[00:22:16] in all cases.

[00:22:17] There's a lot, there's a lot of men out there that either they do it to themselves or it's

[00:22:22] constantly pointed out to them how they don't measure up compared to others.

[00:22:26] Yeah.

[00:22:26] And again, from my perspective, men are very competitive by our nature.

[00:22:33] So having it constantly thrown back in our faces that we're not, we don't measure up.

[00:22:38] That's, that is, that's painful.

[00:22:41] I kind of go, I, you know, I'm always thinking like, cause I, I, you know, whenever you're

[00:22:47] on YouTube or you're on social media or whatever, and you're, you're sometimes these videos pop

[00:22:53] up of different people.

[00:22:54] And a lot of times those videos are taken by someone else to make fun of that person.

[00:23:03] Like there's, there, what I'm, I guess what I'm trying to say is like, there's this one

[00:23:08] show, um, my 600 pound life or something like that.

[00:23:14] And, um, I won't even go into why I think TLC does that show, but other people take snippets

[00:23:22] of the episodes and then they replay them and they do all sorts of like editing to them or

[00:23:28] whatever, just to put these people in worse bad light.

[00:23:31] Like I'm not talking so much about that show, but what I'm trying to say is you don't know

[00:23:38] what that person's struggle is.

[00:23:39] You don't know.

[00:23:41] There are so many like health conditions and medications that people have to take.

[00:23:45] Like for instance, sometimes a woman who has PCOS will, they will gain weight.

[00:23:51] They will have facial hair.

[00:23:54] They will have like crazy body hair and things like that.

[00:23:58] And it's a medical condition that, um, doctors just, they, first of all, doctors don't know

[00:24:05] how to treat women's bodies anyway, but it's almost like we don't know what to do with PCOS

[00:24:10] kind of thing.

[00:24:11] Um, and I know that people are ugly to them.

[00:24:15] You know, I know that people look at those videos or they look at someone that walks in

[00:24:19] and she's overweight and she's got facial hair and she's got whatever.

[00:24:24] She's not your standard magazine model and they're automatically judged.

[00:24:30] But I can tell you that it, not only do they see it in the mirror, but they're constantly

[00:24:35] thinking about it throughout the day.

[00:24:37] So just keep your mouth shut.

[00:24:38] Like everyone is aware of what their appearance looks like.

[00:24:44] That being said, I do want to give one alibi for that.

[00:24:47] Okay.

[00:24:47] You mentioned 600 pound life.

[00:24:50] Those people are getting paid money to parade around in front of cameras.

[00:24:54] Yes.

[00:24:55] So, well, that's why I'm saying like, I don't want to go into that hole.

[00:24:58] What I'm saying is that there is a, there is a cross section of people who I agree.

[00:25:08] We should probably all be a little kind to each other and not make people feel awful about

[00:25:13] their physical appearance, comma, however, comma.

[00:25:15] There is that cross section of people who throw it in everyone's face to the degree

[00:25:21] that you're almost like, you're almost daring the devil asking for a comment.

[00:25:27] Yeah.

[00:25:27] Like, like the girl who's wearing, the girl, we've all heard the joke and most of us have

[00:25:32] said it about how they shouldn't make certain things in certain sizes.

[00:25:36] Mm-hmm.

[00:25:37] Well, if you are five, 600 pounds and wearing, you know, yoga pants or leggings designed for

[00:25:43] a 150 pound woman and all of your stuff is spilling out of them, there is a point at which

[00:25:48] you are literally asking for somebody to say something.

[00:25:53] And if that sounds like big people should dress like big people, I don't care.

[00:25:58] I'm just saying like there has to be some give and take because I'm not going to allow

[00:26:02] you to, I'm not going to, I'm not going to sign off on a person behaving like a butthead

[00:26:09] to get attention and then complaining when they get the attention.

[00:26:12] Okay.

[00:26:13] But since we're on the topic of appearance and, and weight and that where we're at, yeah,

[00:26:17] appearance and weight, would you walk up to that person and say, you really shouldn't

[00:26:22] have worn that to Walmart today?

[00:26:23] I wouldn't, but this has come up a lot recently.

[00:26:27] They've had, they've had plus size, very generously proportioned people who are outwardly complaining

[00:26:34] that like they should, they should make seats on airplanes bigger so that they can have more

[00:26:38] room.

[00:26:38] And I'm like, the minute you make a public statement like that, I am a-okay with anybody

[00:26:43] shame you for your body size because you put it, you made it a public issue.

[00:26:49] Okay.

[00:26:49] I see where you're going with this.

[00:26:51] I'm just, I'm, again, it's like the 600 pound life as the, the, the great example of this.

[00:26:57] I don't, the moment somebody like makes a meme or makes a mockery or whatever of those

[00:27:03] people and their size, they already did it to themselves by parading around in front of

[00:27:07] cameras for money.

[00:27:09] So if anybody comes downstream of that and makes a meme out of it, I don't care.

[00:27:13] You already, you already crossed the Rubicon on that.

[00:27:16] Yeah, I understand.

[00:27:17] I get what you're saying.

[00:27:18] I think what I'm trying to focus on though is like in, in your everyday life, like.

[00:27:25] I'm being devil, I'm playing devil's advocate.

[00:27:27] I know you're playing devil's advocate.

[00:27:29] Just, I guess, and this is going to kind of go for the whole show is just keep your mouth

[00:27:34] shut.

[00:27:34] It's like thumper.

[00:27:35] If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.

[00:27:39] Especially a teenage girl.

[00:27:40] Like keep your mouth shut.

[00:27:43] What?

[00:27:44] What are you looking at?

[00:27:45] We have other things to talk about besides appearance and weight.

[00:27:48] Oh, I know.

[00:27:49] I know.

[00:27:49] Oh God.

[00:27:49] And we talked about this for 30 minutes.

[00:27:51] Okay.

[00:27:51] Sorry.

[00:27:52] Mama bear was on it though.

[00:27:54] I was mad.

[00:27:55] I was.

[00:27:55] That's why we put this one first.

[00:27:57] I was hurt for my, hurt for my kid who's going through something that I've been through my

[00:28:01] whole life.

[00:28:02] But let's get to this because when are you getting married is probably the thing that unmarried

[00:28:07] couples who are together hate hearing worse than everything.

[00:28:11] Yes, absolutely.

[00:28:12] Absolutely.

[00:28:12] Because that was you and me for two and a half years.

[00:28:15] That was our friends going, God, you've been engaged for three years.

[00:28:20] Yes, we were engaged for three years because an engagement wasn't necessarily, it wasn't

[00:28:27] that giant jump that we weren't ready for.

[00:28:30] We knew we wanted to be committed, but we weren't ready for the marriage part yet.

[00:28:34] I don't even know for me if it, because like to me what comes with marriages is that I

[00:28:39] expected the two of us to be like somewhat financially stable, to be financially independent.

[00:28:43] I didn't want the two of us having to depend on our parents to subsidize our living.

[00:28:49] You were still in college.

[00:28:50] I was still in college.

[00:28:53] Like we, we were, we, when I proposed to you, I knew that I wanted to be married to you.

[00:29:00] But I didn't feel like we were at a, we were in a position yet to be able to like, you know,

[00:29:04] go be a married couple and live on our own and take care of ourselves.

[00:29:07] So yeah, we were engaged for quite a few years.

[00:29:10] And for me, it didn't bother me that bad to hear somebody say, when are you getting married?

[00:29:16] But I do know that for other couples, especially couples who maybe have a very non-traditional

[00:29:21] view of marriage and feel like we're, we're living together.

[00:29:25] We're committed.

[00:29:26] We don't need to get married in a church.

[00:29:27] We don't need the piece of paper.

[00:29:28] It means nothing to us at that point to have, it's one thing to ask, when are you getting

[00:29:35] married?

[00:29:35] It's another thing to infer why haven't you gotten married yet?

[00:29:38] Yeah.

[00:29:39] Or why, why aren't you getting married?

[00:29:41] Like that's a requirement.

[00:29:42] Right.

[00:29:43] And I think that's kind of where I wanted to go with some of these topics is like, there

[00:29:48] is, Plaindale was the advocate, there, there is that group of people who are asking this

[00:29:53] totally honest, but you don't know the baggage that person is bringing where they've been

[00:29:58] grilled by their mom for, you know, every time they talk to him for the last six months

[00:30:02] about why hasn't he proposed yet?

[00:30:04] Yeah.

[00:30:04] And then when you say, so when are y'all getting married, your, you might, the reaction

[00:30:09] you get might be that six months of baggage that you didn't know anything about, that

[00:30:13] you didn't participate in, but it's there.

[00:30:15] Yeah.

[00:30:16] Yeah.

[00:30:17] Yeah.

[00:30:17] And it kind of makes me think though.

[00:30:19] So again, another generational thing.

[00:30:23] Like I, I grew up in, this is, this is kind of crazy, but I grew up in a household where,

[00:30:32] you know, boys couldn't spend the night.

[00:30:33] Or if you had your boyfriend over, we couldn't go in our bedrooms and that's totally fine.

[00:30:41] And it's probably going to be the same way with our child.

[00:30:44] But, um, crap, where was I going with this?

[00:30:46] I have no earthly idea.

[00:30:47] Because my, my brain went back to the house that I grew up in and I was thinking of different

[00:30:51] rooms in the house.

[00:30:53] But, um, it's a generational thing where, oh, I know if you're living with your significant

[00:31:01] other already, because we were kind of quasi living together.

[00:31:06] You were in and out for work and school and when you had drill and all that stuff.

[00:31:11] Yeah.

[00:31:11] I mean, I crashed, I crashed at you and your, you and your cousin's place quite a bit, but

[00:31:17] it all, it wasn't as if I was there, I was there very often when I had like a whole day

[00:31:22] off.

[00:31:22] Cause usually I was, you'd come in at night, spend the night and you have to go in the next

[00:31:27] morning.

[00:31:28] And usually we didn't see each other again for a couple of days.

[00:31:31] Um, we certainly didn't see each other every day.

[00:31:34] I mean, quite frankly, back then I was a full-time college student finishing out the last year

[00:31:40] and a half of my natural guard obligation.

[00:31:42] And I had a full-time job anywhere from part-time to a full-time job, depending on when.

[00:31:47] So like I was, and it wasn't just you, my parents said the same thing.

[00:31:52] Like we have a, we have a room with a bed in it and he's here occasionally, but like I was,

[00:31:57] I was always going to do the next thing because that's how busy my life was right then trying

[00:32:02] to get myself established.

[00:32:03] Yeah.

[00:32:04] But I think too, going back to that whole generational thing is if you weren't married, you were not

[00:32:10] to be together alone.

[00:32:11] You should not be together in the bedroom.

[00:32:14] You should not be together, you know, just whatever it was that.

[00:32:19] That's kind of, that's what I feel like.

[00:32:21] And so if that was happening, if you were living together or you were quasi living together

[00:32:26] or whatever, that's when you got the questions of, okay, well, you're not married.

[00:32:30] Why aren't you married?

[00:32:31] You need to be married if you're going to do this.

[00:32:33] That's the kind of impression that I got from my parents is if you're going to do this,

[00:32:36] you better be married kind of thing.

[00:32:39] And oops, it never happened for any of us.

[00:32:41] Both of my sisters came home pregnant.

[00:32:45] Of course they, you know, their life ended up the way that it should.

[00:32:50] That's a whole nother conversation.

[00:32:53] I feel like.

[00:32:54] And then you and I for three years were back and forth living together.

[00:33:00] Some in some capacity, we were living together.

[00:33:03] But again, to me, the thing of it is, is that there, there are those people who the commitment

[00:33:10] between them is not dependent upon a ceremony and a piece of paper issued by the state.

[00:33:15] But what I'm saying is the people who were, who were not, and we didn't get it a whole

[00:33:21] lot, but the people who were saying things were not from our generation.

[00:33:26] They weren't our friends going, dude, you really need to, you know, like marry her before

[00:33:31] you go spend the night at her house.

[00:33:33] Our friends weren't saying that.

[00:33:35] It was grandparents and parents.

[00:33:38] Love you, mom and dad.

[00:33:42] But my mom and dad were the same way.

[00:33:45] And well, actually, I'm, I'm lying.

[00:33:47] They were not.

[00:33:48] They were so, at that point.

[00:33:51] They checked out.

[00:33:52] They had checked out.

[00:33:53] They, they were like, whatever.

[00:33:54] Gillian's the last one.

[00:33:55] We're doing, dealing with all of this stuff.

[00:33:58] I, they really didn't care what I did.

[00:34:00] So anyway, moving on.

[00:34:02] Moving on.

[00:34:03] Moving on.

[00:34:05] When are you having kids?

[00:34:06] Okay.

[00:34:07] We did get this one.

[00:34:08] We, because we waited three years to have Piper.

[00:34:13] There's something about that rule of threes that I see developing.

[00:34:16] Well, and then we're a party of three too.

[00:34:19] Ah.

[00:34:19] Yeah.

[00:34:20] Three's a good number for us.

[00:34:21] Anyway, we waited three years to have Piper.

[00:34:24] Which was because when we got married, I had, I had a year left in college.

[00:34:29] Mm-hmm.

[00:34:30] And then, frankly, you know, we wanted like a couple of years where it was just you and

[00:34:35] me to like stabilize our lives before we brought a tiny, beautiful, screaming human

[00:34:41] being into it.

[00:34:42] The, the conversation that Phil and I had and one that I hope more couples have and how

[00:34:49] we stumbled across this, I don't know, the, me and Phil's relationship, I feel like has

[00:34:56] been guided by some outside force no matter what.

[00:34:59] But we were always having a conversation of forethought.

[00:35:05] We were always thinking ahead.

[00:35:06] We knew eventually we wanted to have children.

[00:35:08] But we also knew that we had to have a secure foundation in our relationship before we brought

[00:35:16] a child into this world.

[00:35:17] And so we watched friends, we watched families who either got pregnant, then got married and

[00:35:26] the struggle that they had, or we watched people, you know, in our lives that had a

[00:35:32] baby before the, the relationship was totally solidified and things like, and, and then the

[00:35:38] relationship fell apart and whatever to each their own.

[00:35:41] But we knew from the very beginning that we wanted to work on our relationship first, create

[00:35:49] a strong enough foundation that we could say what we said to each other and what we still

[00:35:55] say to each other, um, because it's becoming more and more evident as our child gets older

[00:35:59] is she's going to leave and you're going to have me.

[00:36:03] And then I hope you're happy with me because that's what you're going to be left with.

[00:36:08] You know, because eventually it will just be the two of us again.

[00:36:12] But I think because we worked so hard in those three years after we got married and before

[00:36:16] Piper was born to really establish and work on our relationship as a married couple.

[00:36:22] I, I, I really believe that that is what created all of this for us.

[00:36:29] It created the relationship that you and I have and how strong we are together.

[00:36:33] And it also created a, uh, safe place to have a child.

[00:36:38] I feel like, and you, you said that you felt like our relationship is always guided by this

[00:36:44] outside force from my perspective, you know, you and I did things very intentionally throughout,

[00:36:51] like even, even in the earliest phases of us dating, even though there was lots of hormones

[00:36:56] and puppy love and all that.

[00:36:59] But like, I was very explicit with you about these are the things I want.

[00:37:03] I want marriage.

[00:37:04] I want, I want children.

[00:37:06] I want, these are the things I want.

[00:37:08] These are things that are important to me.

[00:37:09] And if they're not important to you, we just need to quit wasting our time and part ways.

[00:37:13] Yeah.

[00:37:13] So like we were always very forthright with each other.

[00:37:16] We were very intentional about how we did things.

[00:37:19] It was never a, we're just going to leave this chance.

[00:37:23] And when we have kids, we have kids.

[00:37:25] It was like, no, no, no.

[00:37:26] We're both going to get our butts out of college.

[00:37:28] We're going to be married first.

[00:37:29] We're going to have a place of our own.

[00:37:32] That place of our own wound up being, you know, we want to be in a house before we have

[00:37:37] a child.

[00:37:38] But it was always a function of like, we're going to do things in a rational, orderly way

[00:37:44] to the degree we're capable of doing that.

[00:37:48] And it was never left to chance.

[00:37:50] It was never, it was never random.

[00:37:52] Our relationship, our, we've always planned our lives.

[00:37:56] And then we've always been willing to change plans when things blow up, but we at least

[00:38:00] had a plan.

[00:38:01] And I feel like that's what separated us from a lot of the couples that we knew back then

[00:38:04] was a lot of them didn't have a plan.

[00:38:07] It was just kind of make it up as they go.

[00:38:09] Right.

[00:38:09] And I was never willing to surrender to that because I remember you and I having a conversation

[00:38:14] one time where you made the, you commented to me, you know, no one's ever ready to have

[00:38:19] children.

[00:38:20] And I'm like, you're right.

[00:38:22] No one is ever ready to have children.

[00:38:25] But there is a difference between knowing I'm not ready and thinking I am, but knowing I'll

[00:38:30] probably have to make it.

[00:38:31] I'll probably have to figure it out as I go.

[00:38:33] So you and I, we laid every brick in this foundation that we could.

[00:38:39] And then we went into this with a firm foundation.

[00:38:42] And then we had to turn the foundation up as we went.

[00:38:45] But there's a difference between that and people who have no firm foundation.

[00:38:48] The bricks are just a line in a pile.

[00:38:50] And then they're like, oh, well, here comes the baby.

[00:38:52] It's time to figure it out.

[00:38:53] So that's why I always look to things like that.

[00:38:57] But for the person that's receiving this question, like sometimes it's because they were doing

[00:39:03] things like Gillian and I were, where it was, we, it's not the right time right now.

[00:39:08] It will be the right time once we get a couple of things taken care of first.

[00:39:12] But for some people, they can't have kids.

[00:39:14] Yeah.

[00:39:14] And then this becomes like the most gut-wrenching, heart, tear your heart out of your chest question

[00:39:21] to get because a lot of those people desperately want to be parents.

[00:39:26] And IVF is insanely expensive.

[00:39:30] Adoption is insanely expensive.

[00:39:33] And unless, unlike for a person without upper middle class means, those things are just largely

[00:39:39] out of your, out of your grasp financially.

[00:39:41] So you're, you're asking a person who wants one thing more than anything in the world already

[00:39:47] is killing themselves that they can't have it.

[00:39:49] If they are the, the party who cannot have children, they're already taking that

[00:39:54] as a gut punch and they're, they're dealing with the guilt because my wife or my husband

[00:39:59] can't be a parent because of me.

[00:40:01] And then you hit them with this.

[00:40:03] Yeah.

[00:40:05] Yeah.

[00:40:05] I mean, I don't know.

[00:40:06] There's nothing else to say after that.

[00:40:08] We thought we were going to have that problem.

[00:40:10] Um, really the next one is, well, I gotta throw this comment.

[00:40:18] Stewart said each banner so far has been a good example of never miss a good opportunity

[00:40:22] to shut up.

[00:40:23] That's true.

[00:40:26] And Stewart shared this while I'm going to share it.

[00:40:29] He said, we wanted kids, still hurts.

[00:40:31] We never could.

[00:40:32] Every damn day it hurts.

[00:40:35] Yeah.

[00:40:36] That one.

[00:40:37] Yeah.

[00:40:37] That one is a hard one.

[00:40:38] When are you having kids?

[00:40:40] Um, and then when, when I told Phil about this show, it was more on the mama bear side

[00:40:46] of stop saying things to teenage girls about their weight and appearances.

[00:40:50] And then he came and told me about the banners that he added.

[00:40:53] And it made me think of the time where we, again, we, um, we got this question a lot and

[00:41:01] it wasn't because we couldn't have kids.

[00:41:03] It was because it was an intentional, we were intentionally waiting to have kids.

[00:41:09] Um, and then we got pregnant and I lost the first pregnancy.

[00:41:15] Wow.

[00:41:16] That one hit hard to say that.

[00:41:18] Um, and so I was scared after that.

[00:41:22] Like, I didn't know, should we be doing this?

[00:41:25] Um, should we try again?

[00:41:27] I don't want to go through this again.

[00:41:28] I don't want to lose another child.

[00:41:30] I don't want to go through the pain of a miscarriage.

[00:41:33] I don't want to do all that again.

[00:41:34] But I was so damn determined because I wanted kids.

[00:41:37] I wanted to have children with you.

[00:41:39] And she wanted four.

[00:41:41] I did.

[00:41:41] I wanted four, which kind of brings me to the next banner of when are you having more

[00:41:48] kids?

[00:41:48] And people would tell me this all the time.

[00:41:51] And this is, we got this a ton from a lot of people.

[00:41:56] A lot.

[00:41:57] And every time I got it, I was more and more mad because we lost our first one.

[00:42:05] The second pregnancy with Piper, I was high risk the entire time, the entire time.

[00:42:10] Um, I almost died giving birth to her.

[00:42:13] I was almost institutionalized after I gave birth to her.

[00:42:17] My postpartum lasted for three fucking years.

[00:42:21] Excuse my language.

[00:42:22] I might have to beat that out.

[00:42:24] It lasted for three years.

[00:42:26] Um, three and a half if you want to think about all the things that kind of dwindled out,

[00:42:31] um, over the last year.

[00:42:35] And when I say I almost died giving birth,

[00:42:40] the doctor, I, we should have sued the doctor for the, for malpractice.

[00:42:46] Um, because when I went in for my, I don't remember two week, three week,

[00:42:54] I don't remember what it was right after I gave birth.

[00:42:57] 40 stitches later, 30 to 40 stitches later.

[00:43:00] I won't go into detail, but, um, it was, it was not pretty.

[00:43:06] And she told me, sure, you can, um, you can have sex again, but you may not be able to have children.

[00:43:14] Um, even a C-section was, uh, not on the table.

[00:43:19] So that was crushing.

[00:43:21] And so when you have all those things and, and after that, after being so mangled from, um, the doctor,

[00:43:30] not doing an ultrasound and seeing that my child was, she wasn't breech.

[00:43:34] Um, she came out with both fists next to her head, her temple like this.

[00:43:39] Um, and if you know anything about female anatomy, this doesn't fit in a birth canal.

[00:43:46] So, um, when she came out blue and not breathing, it was because she had been in the birth canal for too long.

[00:43:51] Um, but my doctor never did an ultrasound and never thought to, uh, hey, say, hey, we probably should have a C-section

[00:43:58] because not only is your child dying, but now you're bleeding to death.

[00:44:01] Anyway, different day, different subject.

[00:44:05] Um, I would have people tell me that I, one, was a horrible mother for not giving her more siblings.

[00:44:13] Literally said that to me.

[00:44:15] You are a horrible mom.

[00:44:16] Why wouldn't you give her more, more, why wouldn't you give her siblings?

[00:44:20] She's going to grow up alone.

[00:44:21] She's going to grow up sad.

[00:44:23] She's not going to have anybody when you die.

[00:44:24] She's not going to have any, um, siblings to help her through the process when you get old.

[00:44:29] And, um, you're going to leave her to do all of that by herself.

[00:44:33] And I mean, just y'all, when I tell you, I was berated by so many people about how awful of a mother I was

[00:44:40] because I am having an only child.

[00:44:44] I, at one point, one of my cousins said that he older, he was, he's my dad's cousin.

[00:44:51] So he's my second cousin.

[00:44:53] He didn't mean anything by it.

[00:44:56] He, he said, but he got it.

[00:44:58] He got the, he got the floodgates open.

[00:45:02] Um, he asked me, he said, what are you going to give her a brother or sister?

[00:45:08] And I think she was either three or four at the time.

[00:45:10] Um, and again, floodgates open.

[00:45:13] And I looked at him and I, um, I said, you know, the reason why I'm not giving her more

[00:45:18] and everything I just told you came out.

[00:45:20] I was like, I can't have any more children.

[00:45:22] Thank you for asking.

[00:45:23] Thank you for, for wondering when she's going to have, she's not going to have more children.

[00:45:27] I mean, more, she's not going to have a sibling.

[00:45:29] I can't have any more kids.

[00:45:30] Or God felt about this tall.

[00:45:32] He did.

[00:45:32] He, and, and I apologize.

[00:45:34] And I, you know, it wasn't right for him to get the, he did, it wasn't right for him to

[00:45:39] get that.

[00:45:40] But I, I told him, I said, don't ask those questions.

[00:45:45] You don't know what I've been through.

[00:45:46] Like we, I didn't go public with everything that happened.

[00:45:50] Um, not until the show started.

[00:45:52] And I started to, I think Piper was probably four or five years old when I was like thinking

[00:46:01] to myself, women are not told this in the doctor's office.

[00:46:04] We're not told about postpartum.

[00:46:07] We're not told about postpartum psychosis.

[00:46:09] We're not told about, um, that you might hear voices and see things and the lack of sleep

[00:46:15] may actually send you into like a manic cycle or what you're not told about those things.

[00:46:22] You're told about rainbows and unicorns and puppy dogs and being one with your child, but

[00:46:27] you're not told about the horrors that women go through when they have children.

[00:46:32] Sometimes.

[00:46:33] Sometimes.

[00:46:34] And sometimes there's women who have 16 children and they're fine every time, whatever.

[00:46:39] I was not one of those people.

[00:46:41] I did not want to go through those things again.

[00:46:43] When I tell you it was the scariest time of my life, I will have my foot ripped off again

[00:46:48] in a car wreck, then go through postpartum and have a child again.

[00:46:52] I, she will be an only child.

[00:46:54] I am forced to remind you of the time that you came to me and asked me like that one

[00:46:59] last, that one, that one last ask about, are you sure we're not having any more kids?

[00:47:05] I asked you.

[00:47:06] Yes.

[00:47:07] And I, I, I put my foot down hard.

[00:47:09] I know.

[00:47:10] I came to you and I said, what if we tried one more time?

[00:47:14] What if we had one more kid?

[00:47:16] What would you think?

[00:47:17] And you were like, absolutely not.

[00:47:19] You didn't want to go through it again.

[00:47:20] Well, but here's the thing about my, my, I, I did a very simple rational calculus in

[00:47:27] my head of, I almost lost you last time.

[00:47:33] And we did lose the first pregnancy, could have lost her when we were pregnant with her.

[00:47:40] So I, all I was seeing was I'm like, okay, there's all these things that have to be risked

[00:47:46] to do this again.

[00:47:48] And I didn't, honestly, my greatest fear at that point was that I was going to have to

[00:47:52] raise her by myself.

[00:47:54] You almost did.

[00:47:55] But therein lies my point.

[00:47:57] That's why I just put my foot down and said, no.

[00:48:01] Like when, when you and I were trying to be children, were trying to be parents the first

[00:48:05] time, I had this thing deep inside of me that was pushing me saying, you need to be a parent.

[00:48:10] The two of you need to be parents, but I didn't feel that afterwards.

[00:48:15] So I've, like you and I've had this conversation about our things I've always said before, like,

[00:48:19] you know, call it gut feeling, intuition, clairvoyance, or, you know, whatever, but like

[00:48:25] whatever you believe in, I get those things deep inside of me that tell me.

[00:48:30] You do.

[00:48:30] Do this or don't do this.

[00:48:32] And when something says, do not do this, you know, you're going to, you are, you are,

[00:48:38] you are going to do it by yourself against me, or you're going to have to accept it because

[00:48:44] I've, I've, something in me is not allowing me to move forward.

[00:48:48] And with regards to that, yeah, I dug in real hard and said, no, this is, this is not, everything

[00:48:54] that we've built, everything we've overcome is at risk again if we do this.

[00:48:58] And it's not a risk I'm willing to take.

[00:49:00] But again, the same reason why, when are you having kids is such a gut punch.

[00:49:05] People that can't have kids, people that can't have more kids, this is a gut punch to them

[00:49:10] because I wanted two, Gillian wanted four.

[00:49:14] We never, we never planned to be one and done, but you know, the best laid plans sometimes blow

[00:49:23] up in your face and you're forced to change plans.

[00:49:26] And, and, and honestly, it's not as unusual as you think.

[00:49:30] There's a lot of women who, whatever happens in that first birth, that's it.

[00:49:36] They're, they are told, they are medically advised not to have more children.

[00:49:41] Some do, and some get, you know, roll the dice and get away with it.

[00:49:46] But it's, it's more common than I initially realized that so many women, after they have

[00:49:53] that first child, that's it.

[00:49:54] Their, their body will not do it.

[00:49:56] And like you said, some, sometimes they'll have three, four, five, 10, 20.

[00:49:59] And it's just.

[00:50:00] Whoa, 20.

[00:50:02] But again.

[00:50:02] Why would you do that?

[00:50:03] Well, consider, consider, consider for a moment that historically, like the.

[00:50:10] It wasn't a real question.

[00:50:11] Okay.

[00:50:12] Sorry.

[00:50:12] No, but what I was saying was historically, like the, the greatest, the greatest risk of

[00:50:17] death to women was always childbirth until more recent times.

[00:50:23] So like, there's a risk.

[00:50:25] Well, yeah.

[00:50:25] I mean, I know if we were in, back in the old ages or whatever.

[00:50:31] Little house on the prairie.

[00:50:32] Even, yeah, even at that level, I wouldn't have made it out of childbirth.

[00:50:37] I would have bled to death.

[00:50:39] Yeah.

[00:50:41] So, anyway.

[00:50:42] So, yeah, there, there's reasons.

[00:50:44] There's probably plenty of reasons why people aren't having more kids.

[00:50:48] And I know you want to move on and we're almost at an hour, but I, again, silence is golden.

[00:50:58] Keep your mouth shut.

[00:50:59] You don't know what they've been through.

[00:51:02] But I also, I also want to say to, you know, people, what am I trying to say here?

[00:51:11] Sorry.

[00:51:11] I'm kind of, I'm struggling with this one.

[00:51:14] Tell them, maybe not in the way that I told my cousin, but tell them, I can't have any more children.

[00:51:21] And, and maybe because what I think happened in that whole conversation is my cousin will never ask another woman, when are they having more kids?

[00:51:29] I don't think he'll ever ask again.

[00:51:31] Because now it's like, oh, you can't.

[00:51:34] Got it.

[00:51:35] I probably should.

[00:51:36] It's like you don't walk up to an overweight woman and go, oh, when's the baby due?

[00:51:40] You don't, you don't say things like that.

[00:51:43] Because, you know, you just don't ask them, when are you having more?

[00:51:47] Because maybe they can't.

[00:51:50] Maybe they don't want to.

[00:51:51] Maybe it's none of your business.

[00:51:52] Maybe it's a tumor.

[00:51:54] It's not a tumor.

[00:51:56] Maybe we're happy being one and done.

[00:51:58] Maybe the, the, the flow in this house and the energy in this house was only meant to be three of us.

[00:52:04] And I, you know, I'm, I'm really glad that you said, no, we're not having any more because I get to focus my whole attention on my one child and she gets all of her mom.

[00:52:17] She doesn't have to split it.

[00:52:19] Not that people who have siblings or multiple kids are doing anything wrong.

[00:52:22] You're certainly not.

[00:52:24] But for us, this is what worked.

[00:52:27] So don't question it because we've thought about it.

[00:52:30] Again, it's usually on people's minds all the time.

[00:52:34] They don't need your help pointing it out.

[00:52:37] True.

[00:52:38] So what's your last one?

[00:52:40] Are we going to talk about the last one?

[00:52:41] Yeah.

[00:52:42] Last one is comments about possessions, home, cars.

[00:52:46] And I feel like this is, I would hope this is the thing that's discussed the least.

[00:52:51] It's a slight departure from the rest of the list.

[00:52:53] Yeah.

[00:52:53] When you said comments about possessions, I was like, I don't really get that question, but okay.

[00:52:59] So has anybody ever commented on the size of our home or the cleanliness of it, the repair of the furniture?

[00:53:09] Other than your sister.

[00:53:11] Other than my mother?

[00:53:13] Well, I was going to say, other than your sister grilling you about not cleaning the baseboards.

[00:53:18] Oh, that's just a thing between me and Phoebe is why haven't you cleaned the baseboards?

[00:53:24] And then with Andrew, why haven't you cut the lawn?

[00:53:26] But not, yeah, that's, but therein lies a thing.

[00:53:30] Like, you know from years of living with me, I'm very particular about taking care of our stuff.

[00:53:35] You know what I'm saying?

[00:53:36] I want our stuff to be in good repair.

[00:53:37] I want the lawn done.

[00:53:39] The lawn needs to be done.

[00:53:42] Can I comment on that?

[00:53:44] Comments about possessions in your home?

[00:53:46] Hey, when are you going to cut the lawn?

[00:53:49] I'll do it after work one day this week.

[00:53:51] One last time before winter.

[00:53:53] Yeah.

[00:53:54] The blackberry bushes are growing into the yard.

[00:53:57] Yes, I know.

[00:53:58] But anyway, but I'm very particular about like keeping the cars clean, keeping the outside

[00:54:04] of the house up.

[00:54:05] And I'm very particular about that because I've always said...

[00:54:09] No comment.

[00:54:10] Keep going.

[00:54:11] Oh, there's a comment in there.

[00:54:12] Keep going.

[00:54:14] But I've always, I've always, I've always...

[00:54:16] Go ahead.

[00:54:18] You've always...

[00:54:20] I'm going to turn the camera off for just a second.

[00:54:22] No, you're good.

[00:54:27] I've always noticed when I was growing up that like people that took care of their stuff,

[00:54:32] it looked nicer than a person that had nice stuff but treated like trash.

[00:54:36] Mm-hmm.

[00:54:38] But I've also heard people comment on people's vehicles and people's houses and, you know,

[00:54:45] like why haven't you gone on a vacation this year?

[00:54:47] And like all these...

[00:54:49] The question that's being asked, even though there were guys say comments about possessions,

[00:54:53] is people are trying to figure out, do you have more money than I do?

[00:54:57] Okay.

[00:54:58] Which is a very sensitive subject, especially for men because like, I don't know, we're

[00:55:03] kind of like pre-programmed and raised to be the providers.

[00:55:08] So if someone calls into question like the lifestyle we're providing for our family, that

[00:55:13] cuts pretty deep very quickly.

[00:55:15] Mm-hmm.

[00:55:16] You know what I'm saying?

[00:55:17] Yeah.

[00:55:20] Is that it?

[00:55:20] I'm just going to let this one go.

[00:55:22] No, you can talk about this one.

[00:55:24] I'm trying to follow what you're saying.

[00:55:27] But it does fit and it makes sense.

[00:55:29] Like, you don't...

[00:55:32] Perfect example.

[00:55:33] Tell me.

[00:55:34] Remember the other day when you brought up vacation and I got a little irritated?

[00:55:39] I did.

[00:55:40] I'm always bringing up vacations.

[00:55:42] Yes, because some people were talking about their vacation to Ireland.

[00:55:46] Oh, yeah.

[00:55:47] Yeah, you did.

[00:55:48] You took that way, way further than it needed to go because that was not the intention of

[00:55:56] the comment.

[00:55:56] What have we been talking about this whole time?

[00:55:59] Well...

[00:56:00] We've been talking about how it comes across to the other person, maybe not how you intended

[00:56:05] it.

[00:56:06] Okay.

[00:56:07] Sorry.

[00:56:09] But again, to me, what I hear when I hear that is, is why aren't you working harder to

[00:56:14] provide more for us?

[00:56:15] And that cuts really, really deep.

[00:56:18] Because from my perspective, it's like, sure, I mean, I could yank several thousand dollars

[00:56:23] out of the 401k and we could go to Ireland for a week or do whatever.

[00:56:27] But I have this long-term outlook on, we need to be able to retire one day.

[00:56:32] We have these dreams of building our own home and I have to put effort towards that or we're

[00:56:39] never going to get there.

[00:56:41] We're in the situation some other people are in where they're living on Social Security and

[00:56:45] dead broke.

[00:56:48] I know.

[00:56:49] I got it.

[00:56:51] I got it that night.

[00:56:52] I understood.

[00:56:53] I knew I had crossed a line and I'm sorry about that.

[00:56:57] But my little wanderer heart, you know, people talk about all their magnificent vacations

[00:57:04] overseas and into all of these beautiful places in the earth.

[00:57:08] And I have a jealous streak and I wish that we could do things like that.

[00:57:12] And I think there are times where we could do things like that if we plan for it and actually

[00:57:17] like budgeted it in of having these wonderful vacations and it wasn't delivered the way that

[00:57:26] it should have.

[00:57:27] I already apologized for it.

[00:57:29] What else do you want?

[00:57:31] Just to have the conversation.

[00:57:33] Sure.

[00:57:34] Which guy?

[00:57:35] No, I'm joking.

[00:57:36] I'm joking.

[00:57:39] Yeah.

[00:57:40] So Joe just threw this up.

[00:57:42] What?

[00:57:43] All the time.

[00:57:44] You spend too much on that old truck.

[00:57:46] Your house is cluttered.

[00:57:47] And he said, I like the truck and we live in it.

[00:57:50] Yeah.

[00:57:50] I have, I used to have a sign because, you know, when signs were the thing to, you know,

[00:57:55] all the word things in your house.

[00:57:57] And it said, sorry for the mess.

[00:58:00] We live here.

[00:58:04] And yet every time someone's coming over, you still do the fly to the bumblebee routine.

[00:58:07] I do.

[00:58:08] And then I tell you and Piper, I was like, it has to look like nobody lives here.

[00:58:12] It, it, we don't live here.

[00:58:14] It has to be clean.

[00:58:15] Baseboards have, we don't live here when people come over.

[00:58:19] Unless it's your father and he comes over and looking for cobwebs and then he sees cobwebs

[00:58:24] somewhere and he's like, oh, you still have your Halloween decorations up.

[00:58:28] And I'm like, oh, I never take those down.

[00:58:30] They're up all year.

[00:58:33] That's another thing.

[00:58:34] Don't comment on my cobwebs.

[00:58:36] We like the spiders.

[00:58:38] I'm joking.

[00:58:39] It doesn't bother me.

[00:58:41] It is what it is.

[00:58:43] So I guess the whole wrap up for this is just very simply like.

[00:58:46] Think like Thumper.

[00:58:48] I was going to, well, more like Stuart.

[00:58:51] Never miss an opportunity to shut up.

[00:58:53] Right.

[00:58:53] But like, you know.

[00:58:54] Wait, time out coming from Stuart and you.

[00:58:57] Never miss an opportunity to shut up.

[00:58:59] I don't know if you two could shut up.

[00:59:02] I love you, Stuart.

[00:59:06] And you podcast.

[00:59:07] That's why you podcast now.

[00:59:09] I'm going to shut up.

[00:59:12] I'm joking.

[00:59:13] Okay.

[00:59:14] Somebody commented.

[00:59:15] It's probably Stuart and he's probably mad at me.

[00:59:18] No.

[00:59:19] Okay, good.

[00:59:20] Anyway.

[00:59:22] Yeah.

[00:59:24] So I guess the whole point of this is really just like, you know, consider for a moment that the question you're asking with no malice in your heart might be carrying a fair amount of additional baggage for the person you're asking.

[00:59:37] And just, you know, be considerate of that.

[00:59:41] Be considerate of the way you're asking, the place you're asking and all that.

[00:59:47] But, um.

[00:59:49] There is love, Dad.

[00:59:51] What are you talking about?

[00:59:53] Your dad said, I'm feeling the love.

[00:59:55] There's love.

[00:59:57] There's love.

[01:00:00] Anyway.

[01:00:02] Is that all?

[01:00:02] That's all.

[01:00:03] Okay.

[01:00:04] I see.

[01:00:05] I made it weird again.

[01:00:06] I have to start the show weird and then I have to end the show making it weird.

[01:00:09] That's just a thing.

[01:00:11] Because it's weird.

[01:00:13] I'm weird.

[01:00:14] I'm awkward.

[01:00:17] Anyway.

[01:00:19] All right.

[01:00:19] So let's go ahead and wrap this up so you can finish the rest of your day being weird.

[01:00:24] I make no apologies.

[01:00:27] Well, thank you all for joining us today.

[01:00:29] Bye.

[01:00:29] And, um, if you're listening, thanks for listening and we'll see you next week.

[01:00:34] Bye everybody.

[01:00:35] Bye y'all.