Church & State - Remembering Charlie Kirk One Year Later with Tiffany Benson

Spokane Valley could become a sanctuary city of a different kind. Councilman Caleb Collier says that this proposal. I'm proposing that the city of Spokane Valley issue a proclamation stating that our city is a Second Amendment sanctuary city. Welcome to the fire. Welcome to the fire. What? Where are you? Today on Church and State, two former Turning Point employees discuss the anniversary of the death of Charlie Kirk. Hello, Christian patriots, and welcome to Church and State, where we drive morality and religion over tolerance and apathy. And I'm your host, Caleb Collier, once again, your favorite far-right shock jock. And the show that talks about politics and religion, Jesus Christ is our referee, so it's always nice and clean. Real quick, let's point you to the website, churchandstate.media. Fill out the registration form for us. Number one, you're going to get our newsletter. You're going to bypass a lot of that censorship. 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She's an incredible woman, former employee of Turning Point. I got to know her there. We actually did an event together where we informed everybody about the current state of public education. But Tiffany, it is an absolute pleasure to have you back on the show. Well, I appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. We had a lot of fun last time you were on the show and we were talking about the myth of education. You run a great organization. Empowering parents as they will hopefully get out of public education, honestly, is our what you and I both want. But really empowering parents in the education of their kids. Yes. Well, unfortunately, there's not going to be as many people coming out of public schools or at least not as fast as we want them to. And so if you're not going to pull them out of public schools, then you still have to make a sacrifice somewhere and make sure that you are asserting your rights or litigating them if school districts are robbing you of that. So that's where I'm there to be an advocate. Well, I love it. We need more people like you and your organization. You also run a great podcast, mythofeducation.com. And Chris can show that to the audience. But you are bringing on guests. You're talking about this subject. And it's such an important one because I want more parents to have access to this information. I feel like a lot of parents are just blissfully unaware of what's going on in schools around America. They are. I don't know if I would say blissfully. They are waking up in some of the harshest ways. The U.S. Department of Education over the summer launched an initiative to combat sexual misconduct against our K-12 students. I actually reside in the Peoria Unified School District. So anybody that's following K-12 news, we went national with a police raid because our board president and PR department didn't want to comply with search warrants. after some accusations came against two alleged pervert teachers. So that's one of the ways that parents are waking up. And I think a second way, unfortunately, that they're waking up, they've got young adults in their house that just graduated. And unfortunately, it's a little late, but they're finding out their kids can't read and can't fill out their job applications or balance a checkbook. So it's bad. That is so bad. So bad. I don't want to go all the way down this rabbit trail because I didn't bring you on the show to talk about this. That's what we discussed last time. But my gosh, parents, if your kid doesn't know how to read and they've already graduated high school, like, yeah, it's a little bit too late at that point. I would encourage parents, I guess, with younger children to start quizzing them. Like it used to be a thing where parents would go, and read bedtime stories to their kids. Maybe bring that back and see if your kid can actually read the book. And if not, there's your sign right there. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Let's move on and let's talk about 9-10. We are fast approaching the one-year anniversary of the death of our former boss. You worked for TPUSA. You were really tackling the education side of things. I worked for TPUSA Faith. But we were able to unite and do some things together in Arizona. It seems surreal to me. I mean, I still cannot believe it. And Tiffany, I don't know about you, but there were events in my life where I remember everything. I remember smells. I remember what I was doing exactly. 9-11 was one of those days for me. The death of Charlie Kirk, I will remember for the rest of my life exactly what I was doing, who I was talking to. Is it the same for you? Yes, I was out to lunch with a friend at an Indian restaurant and we were talking about things going on in K through 12 education and my phone started blowing up and I saw a message, but I just kind of froze. I didn't pick up any phone calls. I didn't respond to any texts. I immediately went to Google, started swiping down, like refresh, refresh, refresh, refresh. Is this for real? And then unfortunately, someone sent me a clip that was going viral of Charlie. Now that day, I didn't know he was wearing that white freedom shirt. I didn't know what I was looking at. And unfortunately it was the video where he took the next shot. I could have gone the rest of my life, never seeing that. That person gave me no context, just sent me the link. So anybody who has not seen that video, don't watch it. Don't it's extra. It's a little, a little bit of extra trauma you don't need in your brain. So Yeah, I was actually, I was talking to another former employee of TPUSA. Um, and we were just kind of catching up, just talking. And he was, he was, uh, it was, it was kind of a long winded, uh, conversation. He was, he was talking and all of a sudden I interrupted him. And I think, I think I said, Holy crap. And he was like, what? Like, I didn't say anything that interesting. And I was like, no man, Charlie Kirk just got shot. And at that point, I mean, I watched the videos I did. Um, Now I'm a former EMT and I was talking to some other people. More people were calling in and they're like, well, maybe he could survive. And with my training, I was like, no, he's gone, guys. He's gone. So, yeah, it really impacted me. Obviously, you know, both of us are working for Charlie. He was a brilliant man. I mean, being around him, his mind was absolutely incredible. Yes. So I didn't know Charlie Kirk personally because I've had people ask me that. But it was the sort of thing where I had seen him at the gym or had a couple of parking lot conversations. I could tell he recognized my face. And I don't know if he ever really I mean, I think he knew my name, too. But it wasn't I was never one of the types of people like, oh, my gosh, let me get a selfie. I wish I had gotten a selfie with him now, not knowing he was going to be gone so soon. But I always say he is the best boss I've ever had, the best CEO I've ever had. That is not a statement of any sort of perfection other than possibly morally. It didn't come out after he died that he had mistresses and illegitimate children and blah, blah, blah. He loved God for real. And you can feel that impact that he was truly a son of God. It hit in a different way than when other people pass away. Yeah, I completely agree with you. And I've also been very, very honest with people because I never want to misrepresent myself. I worked for Charlie. I didn't know him personally. I was around him. We heard him speak a lot. You know, obviously, you know, I was able to ask him some questions a few times, but. It wasn't like. hey, Charlie, it's Caleb. Oh, yeah. Hey, man, how you doing? No, it wasn't like that at all. And he was really a good boss. And for me, one of the things that was really interesting in watching him was his transition. When he came in, it was more of the Republican conservative movement, And he even said some things as a Christian that I didn't agree with very, very early on. But as to be able to watch him as he pursued the Lord and Charlie Kirk, you know, by the time he died, man, that guy knew the Bible. He knew the word of God. He he treasured it. And you could see it like his faith was so self-evident. Yes, that is probably for me, the thing that I would say made him the best CEO that I worked for. He was very open with his beliefs and there wasn't anything contrary in his personal character, right? As you said, we didn't know him intimately, just kind of some flyby conversations up close and personal. We got to see the behind the scenes talks, unscripted, all the things, but his faith in God was, was very admirable. And from what we can tell, he lived it publicly. I mean, he lived it. And I think that there are a lot of Republican conservative people that should take a cue from Charlie. Don't just wave your Bible around, but be biblical in how you're conducting the people's business if you're representing us in the public square. Amen. I completely agree with that. Now, When you and I, you had actually texted me saying you'd love to come on the show and just kind of have this recap as we're approaching this anniversary, this tragic anniversary. But you and I were. Talking about, you had asked me the question, you said, well, how do you feel about Candace Owens? And we found. That we disagreed with each other, but here's the thing, we enjoy each other's company. We can have disagreements. Like that's another really important point that I just, I love to showcase is that hey, if somebody is a Christian, somebody is a conservative, you can disagree about things and still call each other a friend at the end of the day. Yeah. OK, well, I mean, full disclosure, I think she has a legion and that there is some sort of principality that has gotten a hold of her. She's she's quite the mouthpiece for the devil. And I don't think that she has proven anything. Let me not mislead people to think that I sit and watch all of her podcasts or that I watched her bride of Charlie, her play on bride of Chucky. Um, I just can't get my head into all of that. And then with the Robinson trial, I am more of like a court TV, Vinnie Paul, 10, um, legal analysis type person. So I haven't watched a thousand hours. I really can't, It's such a roller coaster. But from what I can discern, Candace has proved nothing. But her followers don't necessarily demand that of her. They just want the juicy bits. But here's one thing that I will concede with Candace Owens that she should probably look more into is the financial goings-ons at TPUSA. I would say 90% of the time, she's crazy. But financially speaking, she was onto something with that, for sure. Yeah, I would definitely agree with you on that one. You know, when it comes to Candace Owens, I can appreciate her. I don't agree with everything she says by no means. And I would like a little bit more evidence or proof put forth on her shows. And also, I don't watch. Everything that she's doing. I catch little tidbits, little clips. You and I are both very, very busy people, so we don't have all the time to be these internet sleuths just pouring through X or something, watching everything that they're doing. But what I will say about her is she did love Charlie as a friend. And you can tell that this really impacted her, the death of her friend. And I appreciate the fact that she's kicking over every single rock. I think we need more of that. And when it comes to Tyler Robinson, the alleged shooter, I find that to have so many holes in it. Nothing about him as the shooter makes sense to me. Now, I'm going off of some of my experience in the Marine Corps, the fact that I know firearms pretty well. I've shot. 30- 06s a lot. These are a hunting rifle, and at that range, which it wasn't all that far, that would have darn near taken his head off. The idea that his bones were so dense... that they stopped the bullet, I find to be rather ludicrous. I have questions over why you would pave over a crime scene almost immediately afterwards. Certainly the actions of the people around him are kind of suspicious, some of the security details. And then the idea that this guy, well, he went up there, assembled the rifle, took the shot, took the time to disassemble the rifle, jumped off the roof, ran into the woods where he reassembled the rifle. Nobody does that. Well, to your point about paving over the crime scene, that was probably one of the most bizarre details. And what that reminds me of is right after JFK got shot, they took the car, you know, to the hospital there in Dallas, and they washed the car. I mean, so they could not analyze blood spatter, you know, patterns, things like that, which, which directions the bullets were coming from. There were documentaries that I watched that showed a bullet came through the front windshield, all the things. And so I think that they're, Anytime that somebody who is well-known or a politician or whatever, when they die, there's always conspiracy and conspiracy theories that are going to surround their death. It's up to us to be discerning, to try to stay as logical as possible, entertain very little until as much evidence can come out. My hope is that because we have the administration, we have an office when it did happen, that this FBI is not covering up anything maybe with the exception of something that could cause a riot, which we don't really riot as conservatives, but our government does not have a history of being honest when these sorts of things happen. And some of those details are pretty crazy, but I feel like there was enough DNA at that crime scene that it was him that took that shot. Okay. Yeah, I can respect that. I will say, I think you have a little bit more faith in our current FBI than I do. To me, this is the same FBI that's telling us there is no Epstein files. So I struggle a little bit there. I got to be honest. Yeah. Well, they lied to our faces. What was her name? Pam, Pam Bondi. Like you could just tell she had this deer in a headlights look because her And several others had campaigned on opening up these files. And I honestly think what they saw is that there were a lot of powerful people who were child molesters and rapists. And these are people that they needed to be able to probably do business with. And some plausible deniability of those people could say, well, we thought that those girls were 18. So Anyway, yeah, I mean, my faith is in God, but I try to have, like, this little measure of hope in humanity. Like, don't lie about this, but we'll see what happens. We're still waiting. Indeed. Now, what do you make? Now, personally, I believe that it was the mic pack, the Rode mic pack. I've slowed down the footage a number of times, watched multiple different angles. It appears that there's an explosion from the mic pack and that the neck wound. Is actually an exit wound from the shrapnel. That is my personal belief there. But what do you make of. Charlie had recently, like right before his death, started to go not necessarily against the nation of Israel, but just against being told what. To do and what he can say. And there were some very powerful lobbyists, even within Turning Point, that were very upset with this move of his. Well, I think that they had a right to be upset. I'll start there. Because for one, he was not going to give up his relationship with Tucker Carlson, for example. And Tucker Carlson, whether he realized it or not, he was starting to lean very anti-Semitic in some of his podcasts and some of his reports. However, this is what I will say about CK. He was a truth seeker, right? So he's going to these college campuses, And all of a sudden, he's getting this overwhelming influx of questions about Israel and the war and whether or not we should be a part of it. And this young generation, they don't ascribe to the Genesis 12, 3, just automatically, you know, supporting Israel because God has blessed them. They had questions. Charlie was seeking answers to those questions because It wasn't something that he— he knew the Bible well, but I don't think that he knew all of the history and geopolitics and connections that Gentiles and Jews have had, respectfully, over the last hundreds and hundreds, thousands, whatever, of years. And so that's what I think. I don't know that he was necessarily going against it. when people started to call him anti-Semitic. You know, we were still working for him at the time. I was appalled. I was appalled that right-wing media was associating him with— what' s the stupid guy— I can't think of his name. Nick Fuentes? Yes, yes. Associating him with people like that. And I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, we have an entire project. We send people and students to Israel every year. You don't know what you're talking about. The questions that Charlie asked after that attack happened, I asked those same questions. I just didn't have a platform. How did that happen? What security intel did Netanyahu not have? Those are not anti-Semitic questions. So... I don't think he was turning against Israel. I think he was asking questions that GOP people and far right people don't like for you to ask if you're in this party or on this side. I completely agree with that assessment right there. To me, the term anti-Semitism, it gets thrown around far too often and it's designed to shut people down. It's like for me, if I were to say something about Black Lives Matter, a negative comment about Black Lives Matter, What's going to get thrown at me? I'm racist, right? I'm not. You know that. But it's a weapon. That group don't represent me, so. Say what you want. I know. I know that you feel that way. So once again, to me, when I hear people just throwing around, you're an anti-Semite. For daring to question Israel, to ask questions about what occurred at that rave and why it took so long for them to bring in any kind of support for them, I mean— We're told Israel has one of the greatest militaries, and it took like, what, seven hours for them to respond to this attack by Hamas? Those are legitimate questions, and I don't feel like I need to all of a sudden stop what I'm asking or what I'm doing and defend the fact that I'm not an anti-Semite. No, and I don't think you should do that. I think that's the plot of radical people, emotional people who are not rational. Don't stop and answer those types of questions or defend yourself or anything. Stay in that vein that is forcing them to come to a rational conclusion or at least a rational line of questioning that you have. Some people didn't receive help for what, six, seven, eight hours. And they know that these crazy demonic people and that false God Satan that they worship, that they're going to attack on different holidays, things when your guard is down. And it just seems so unacceptable to me that that happened. And I still don't feel like we have seen a public questioning of Netanyahu, of what intel he had. At some point, I feel like because of the ongoing war, and we are so politically connected with him, that press conference or whatever, like, it still needs to happen. Those questions still need to be answered. And ethnically, culturally, religiously, whether or not you're Jewish, that doesn't have anything to do with it in that moment. Amen. I mean, Tiffany, you have an American flag behind you. I've got a lot of patriotic symbolism behind me as well. I question my own government constantly. There's a lot of things my own government does that I really oppose, really dislike. Isn't it fair for me to throw that same kind of skepticism towards any other nation in the world? Yes. And honestly, from what I can say, if you're watching podcasters or pundits who are not necessarily mainstream, but they have that strong following and they are Jewish people. They're just like me and you. Like these are not people that are like, oh, our government is so great. From what I can remember, I think there are about to be riots and all sorts of stuff that was breaking out because they were upset about how their government was handling some things. There are lots of Muslims that live in Israel and there is a peaceful existence that happens despite what their book says versus what the Torah says. So I would tell people not to be fooled by what's happening, mainstream media, government, you should question all of that because those of us that are citizens and that are on the ground level, there are a lot of things that we agree about. I have not met a Jewish person that was offended or listened to a Jewish person that was offended because people outside their country were asking, you know, WTH, what happened? Sure. Now returning back to Charlie, um, Do you think some of this transition, as he started to explore, as you pointed out, he really knew the Bible, but exploring different theories or theologies within Christianity, he had started to. Bring in a lot of the Reformed people. You and I both saw this at events that we worked at where people like Doug Wilson were brought in and was given a place of honor to speak. Do you think that his association with more of the Reformed and the introduction to covenant theology might have contributed to him asking these kinds of questions about Israel? I think that's possible, full disclosure. So I am Pentecostal, Charismatic, I think that's probably as far away from the reformed wing that you can get. But as we were talking about before this show, to kind of sort of shake myself loose of that everything is the Holy Spirit. No, it's not. I actually started listening to reformed people to kind of shake myself loose of some of the doctrines and ways of the Pentecostal church. And so I'm familiar with Doug Wilson. I'm familiar with John MacArthur, although I do think he hated women or something. And so one thing I can tell you about RTs, for the most part, if you, for me, if you divorce so much of that lens that they're interpreting scripture with underneath it, it's still the truth that a lot of Reformed Christians that I've had conversations with, I can discern the Holy Spirit in them, even though, you know, they'll probably never pray in the spirit. But I think having that sort of focus on the end times and the role that Israel is going to play because our Bible is. It's a very Eastern book. It's very Israel-centered. The Bible, like it or not, it is a very pro-Israel book. It's not a pro-USA book. So Charlie was on the right path, asking the right questions, and he was doing it not just from a political perspective or a financial perspective, what's this going to cost us, but this is the God of the Gentiles is also, according to the Bible, the God of the Jews. So. Sure. And, you know, I say this all the time on the show and when I'm interviewed, but the God who created everything isn't afraid of our questions. You know, we can ask these types of questions. If we're pursuing him, we can go down the wrong path and get corrected. And that's part of our Christian walk. it's not only acceptable, I would say it's preferable. And I point this out all the time, but when Paul brought the message, the good news to the Bereans, they didn't just accept it right away. They searched the scriptures to see if what he said was true. And Paul commended them for that action. So I encourage people, walk down these paths, explore these different theologies or ideas that are part of our Christian faith. You and I were talking, these are secondary issues. As long as we keep our eye on the ball that Jesus Christ is the Lord and He died for our sins, you know, I don't think it's going to be a problem. I don't think heaven's only going to be filled with with Pentecostals or in my case, Lutherans. No, it's going to be filled with a lot of different people. And all of us are going to figure out we were wrong about something when we get there. I agree with that. And we should all be Berean Christians. We have no excuse in the West to not read the Bible. We should not take a pastor's word for everything, just like we shouldn't take a politician's word for everything. We want to be able to say that our pastors, priests, whatever you ascribe to, that they are preaching the truth But the fact of the matter is, is we're seeing a lot of exposure, especially in the Protestant church. We're not any better than the Catholics that had their controversy. A lot of ministers are turning out to be perverts. They're touching kids, stealing wives, taking money. So you really have to have your own relationship with God. You can't get in by anybody's coattails. And studying something like the end times, right, or why we would be connected to Let me pause you. There real quick, Tiffany, because we hit a hard break here. But I'm going to come back. We're going to talk about eschatology. We're going to talk about covenant theology versus dispensationalism. So stay tuned for that, ladies and gentlemen. Hey, this is Caleb Collier with Church and State. And I want to tell you about methylene blue. For a long time now, you've seen the Maha people using methylene blue. 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And one more time, hit the donate button for us. Big things are coming with with church and state. I got to tell you, I can barely keep up anymore. The amount of interview requests that I'm getting, the amount of times I'm being asked to be on. Other people's shows. It's just expanding exponentially. and we do need help to continue to do so. So please hit the donate button for us. All right, with that, let's go back to our guest, Tiffany Benson. And now I rudely had to interrupt her. I hate doing that, but it's the nature of the beast here. She had just gotten into eschatology, and this is a fascinating conversation, one I love. So Tiffany, please continue with what you were saying. Oh, I don't even remember where I left off, but I think I was talking about studying out our connection to Israel and being Berean Christians and not just taking pastor's word for it. Very few ministers are dealing with the end times. They have decided to ignore the events of the world and isolate themselves as just Christians do their own thing. That is completely opposite the way that I read the scriptures. I believe that the Sanhedrin, those sects of the Pharisees, Sadducees, et cetera, some of them were also governmental leaders over the people of Israel. underneath that rule of the Romans. Um, so those were their courts, their magistrates, their politicians, if you will. Um, John the Baptist got his head taken off cause he told a ruler, you can't sleep with your brother's wife. You know what I mean? So people read the Bible, um, through Western eyes. And I think that that's a mistake. I would 100% agree with that. Uh, that is, um, a condition of Americanism that we tend to, uh, view everything through the lens of America. And sorry, guys, America is not really mentioned in the Bible. In fact, it's not at all. So, you know, that doesn't mean that we're going to cease to exist or anything like that. I'm not claiming that. But we do need to go. Through that lens, as you said, through the more of that that Eastern lens. This is this is who they were talking to. And it definitely opens things up when you read the. Bible that way. But eschatology is a really interesting subject and it divides Christians. I don't think it should. I think when we look at it and whether you're pre-trib, mid-trib, post-trib, preterist, futurist, amillennialist like I am, you know, there's a lot of different theories that are in to what's going to happen at the end of days. But one of the things that really has divided a lot of people is that covenant theology versus dispensationalism. And I got to say this, and then I'll turn it back over to you. I really am going. To caution people and in fact, encourage people to not call people like myself who, who subscribe to covenant theology as believers in replacement theology, because that's, That's not true. And it kind of goes back to what we were talking about with the charges. Of racism or anti-Semitism. If you're being honest, dispensationalism is actually a much newer belief system than covenant theology is. And so if you were going to throw an accusation of replacement theology, it would actually be more on the dispensationalists than covenant theology. But anyway, I'll turn it to you. Well, to state, I guess, kind of the obvious of our conversation is If you just focus on the rapture doctrine as your form of study for eschatology, you are going to miss literally everything else that the Bible says about it. The word rapture, I believe, is a Latin derivative of the Greek word that was used there. So the word rapture is not even in the Bible. But that's not all of eschatology. You really need to study prophecy. And so the whole Bible is prophetic, but specifically eschatology. there are visions that Ezekiel saw, that Daniel saw, that align with what you read in Revelation that John saw, and even some things that are going on in Paul's letters to the Romans and things like that. So studying in times, it's for me, it's not me trying to find my place when it comes to all of those theological perspectives, really trying to pray and stay humble and so that the Holy Spirit will just reveal to me directly what I need to know. Where am I on God's timeline? Because I'm looking at the news and then I'm reading scripture and some things look like they're speeding up, but then we have so many mundane days. And so that's, that's how I look at it is, you know, I've always got my eye on the Eastern sky, but I don't, I'm not partial to that doctrine of like imminence that it could happen at every time. I very much respect prophecy and and what I can discern as having that come to pass because the Lord's word is not going to return void. He's not going to just do away with revealing the antichrist or doing those things and, and just go off, you know, script for his own timeline in the word. Sure. And bringing Charlie back into this conversation, I personally believe that his association with some of these people who subscribe to covenant theology was one of the, one of at least the catalysts, For Charlie starting to push back and ask these types of questions of, you know, this idea that, you know, according to the New Testament, as I read it, and we can disagree here, but, you know, going to like Galatians, for example, it wasn't. And as my new friend Chad Prather says, it's not race, it's grace. And so this idea that those who believe in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior are God's chosen people. And this is something that the church taught for centuries before Darby and Schofield introduced dispensational beliefs to really to America and then through the entire world beyond that. But I do believe that Charlie was starting to go that direction or at least ask those types of questions. And I think that might have had something to do with what happened to him. Well, we'll come back to that, but I would say covenant theology. All right. So I haven't studied that very deeply. I put that over, uh, on the reformed side of things, but I do believe in covenant, right? So the noatic covenant, that's your rainbow, the Abrahamic covenant, that sign was the force, the foreskin, um, the Davidic covenant and God making that promise that a descendant would always be on the throne, et cetera, et cetera. So when you come into the new Testament, I don't know if people realize this, but when you come into the New Testament, you're still under the law until Christ is resurrected. Right. Like that covenant doesn't start until his blood is shed. And then from that point forward, he's sending his disciples out with a mandate, as you see in Acts chapter one and two, where the church is born. Now, I have studied out Romans nine through eleven, and I recommend that everybody study out Romans nine through eleven. It can be kind of difficult because when you're dealing with the Lord, right? He is in eternity. He is eternity, right? Eternity is in him. So we are trying to understand things with this finite understanding. And what we do is where we don't understand things, sometimes we will come in with a theology, something that a man explained that sounded really smart. And because they're smarter than us, we just apply that as a sort of foundational doctrine. Go back through Romans 9 through 11. And I think that if you pray, you will be able to discern that there is a covenant that God still has with Israel, especially concerning that plot of land. And of course, I have to say for all my Western sisters and brothers, Jesus was not a Gentile. He is a Jew. And so that more than anything connects us to the Israeli people. But the chosen people of God, it can be both. It's Jewish people. And then it's also the church. We are all of the people of God. in that respect, right? That covenant is for everybody, but you do need to put faith in Jesus Christ. The apostle Paul is very clear that your ethnicity and lineage of Abraham is not what's going to get you into heaven. You do have to be born again. And the confusion can kind of come in when you get into Galatians, where it talks about the true sons of Abraham are those of us who believe. He is called the father of our faith. He's in the 11th chapter of Hebrews. as being a true man of God. And that was long before the law or any else, you know, anything else came into place. Last thing I'll say, and I'll kick it back to you, is that before Abraham was circumcised, was he a Jew? No. Circumcision is that sign. So you got to study everything. I always tell people, read the whole Bible, don't cherry pick. Well, I mean, I think that is such good advice. One of my pet peeves is people who just cherry pick the Bible. And you see it across all denominations. You know, it's not singular to one, um, but everybody's doing this to justify. Their own ends. As you said, uh, you know, smart theologians have come up with ideas and, uh, it just becomes doctrine. Uh, and you know, I, once again, I think it's fair and the proper thing to do to, to ask these types of questions. Uh, I love your take on this, you know, um, I've had conversations, I even, I got attacked at CPAC, not physically, but I got. Attacked by some Zionists. Who told me that until I came to the conclusion that there are two paths to God, the Jewish way and the Christian way, that my theology was incomplete. And I'm sorry, you know, if that's offensive to people, my belief that no, there's only one way. Well, you know what? If that's offensive to. You, go read the Bible because Jesus said that there's only one way to the father and that's through him. Well, I think what people may not understand, you have to read again, Romans nine through 11, Israel rejected Christ, right? So according to some of the extra laws or teachings or whatever that they put in place, they weren't just straight prophecy people, believe it or not. There is a form of Judaism that Abraham did not practice that is claimed today. And so the understanding that people may or may not have, it just has to do with whether or not you're reading it for yourself. They did reject Christ. The gospel was made available to the Gentiles, but Christ did go to his own people first. I would not say that your theology or that your relationship with God is incomplete because because you see it that way, we do have to come through Christ. There is no ifs, no ands, no buts about it. Anything that you may understand or not understand about covenant is that there is always a sign of a covenant. That's what I was saying a moment ago about the rainbow, the circumcision. Well, the sign of this covenant that we're under now is the blood. So in terms of animal sacrifices and the Levitical priesthood and all those things, Jesus Christ fulfilled that. He didn't abolish that. He fulfilled it. So putting your faith in him, that that is where your salvation comes from. I would argue that the covenants of the Old Testament, those are also faith based. It says in Genesis that when Abraham believed God in chapter 15, it was counted to him as righteousness. That was hundreds of years before the law. And he figured out how to build an altar and burn sacrifices and all the things just by hanging out with God on a hill. So, you know, there's a lot of pride behind Judaism, as there is a lot of pride behind those of us who call ourselves Christians. The Bible specifically says to be careful where you stand, lest you fall. Well, I think it's a very good warning right there. We're coming down to the end of the show, but I want to ask you one more question. And it's centered around Charlie Kirk. Here we are at the one year tragic anniversary. You and I worked for him. We saw what he was about. What would you your your words of encouragement or what direction would you point people to to honor Charlie's legacy? How should people live their lives? What should they be pursuing? First, pursue Christ, because that is what C.K. would tell you to do before your political career. Make sure that you know who the Lord is, because at the end of the day, this is man's kingdom. It's going to perish, and his kingdom is eternal. For those who don't understand or know who CK was or what he stood for, all of the videos are available online still. Turning Point is still releasing. I think they're even putting out footage that may have never even been seen before. Whoever is running Erica's account is putting out lots of good stuff about their relationship, their marriage. You can get a real picture of what kind of man of God he was. Follow Christ first. But there are earthly examples. And I would venture to say I might get some pushback on this, but I would put Charlie probably in that hall of faith. You know, I mean, you're not going to find his name in the Bible, but he he lived what a lot of those apostles lived. That needs to be everybody's pursuit is to pursue Christ above everything else, because there's nothing else outside of that is the Lord. He's life. He's everything. I think that's a really rock solid advice there. You want to know who Charlie was? Go and do the research. It's out there, as you pointed out, and get involved. You know, that was something that Charlie really, really pushed is for Christians not to sit on their hands, to not have this. this pious belief that, you know, this kingdom's not of this world, so I don't have to worry about it. It can go to hell in a handbasket and Christ is king. That's accurate, but we're not supposed to sit on our hands. I'll quote James there, faith without works is dead. So get in there, do some works, because Charlie was certainly working his tail off. Tiffany, how do people listen to your podcast? We'll bring it up again, but please plug the podcast for us. You can go to mythofeducation.com. to listen to past episodes. Uh, we are on socials at myth of education, X, Y, T, and I G. So there we go. All right. Well, I so appreciate your work, uh, your friendship. I'm so glad that we were able to meet as coworkers and, and turning point. Um, but we'll have you back on, uh, you know, this is your second appearance. I love having you on. You're a great guest. And, uh, once again, we can disagree on some things and still at the. Of course. All right. Well, I'm going to go ahead and let you go. If you hold on one more minute post-production to say our goodbyes, I'd appreciate it. But again, thank you for joining us on Church to State. Thank you very much for having me. Absolutely. All right, ladies and gentlemen, there you go. Questions, you know, and honestly, questions are a way of honoring the legacy of Charlie Kirk. We should be able to ask these questions. To seek out through the free market people like Tucker or Candace, or if you don't like what they're saying, people like Ben. Shapiro or Erica Kirk. The truth is out there, and I don't think it's wrong for us to pursue it. The Church and State is brought to you in part by Colonial Life, Spokane Independent Agents, Finders Insurance, and Mark37. Com. I'm Caleb Collier. I was born for a storm. Welcome to the fire. Hey, this is Caleb Collier with Church and State. 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